A Name to a Face: What to Do When Metagamed?

[magistrasa]

I'm sure we've all been there before. You're making conversation with someone, maybe it's interesting and maybe it's not, but then, it happens - they say your name. You know you didn't share your character's name. Maybe you've made a point to not tell your character's name to anyone, and maybe it's a big part of the character's persona to even go around in disguise so as to minimize name recognition. But it happens anyways, and now everyone in the vicinity knows it. You try to play it cool, try to leave it unacknowledged, but then you later get a speedy messenger, a wisp from a stranger, and a conjuration call from someone you've never interacted with - all because one person innocently didn't realize that you were trying to be incognito.

Okay, maybe most people haven't been there and I'm just profoundly unlucky. (I'm sure I even got scried in a positively reputation-ruining moment of un-warded privacy, but we'll find out next time I log in.)

This has happened SEVERAL times to me on my current character - the latest instance coming with potentially catastrophic consequences for the character, which feels Great - and I am completely blindsided every time it happens. I just don't know how someone ought to react to a thing like that. Surely it's considered poor form to send a tell to EVERYONE in earshot asking then to "retcon" that knowledge (and probably only invites further metagaming by cementing yourself as a shady, secretive individual). Ignoring it hasn't really worked so far because it just leads to the person spreading that meta knowledge, and legitimizing it with a reaction has had mixed results. Presumably there's nothing the DMs can really do about it because it's not a rule break so much as an unfortunate lapse in attention, and once the knowledge is out there's no point in trying to pull it from people's brains. Rare is the occasion that it's done with ill-will (though I've actually seen one metagamer claim that they can read minds, so I'm classifying that as "ill-will"), so I can't even rightly be mad when it happens. Without righteous fury and the license to yell at someone until I feel better, I'm at a loss!

What the heck should a person do in these sorts of situations? What can be done to prevent it from happening? Does anyone have a time machine I can borrow to just go back 24 hours and save myself the inevitable frustration I'm going to have to face?

[xanrael]

Any time I'm playing a secretive character I have a plan B if they get found out that at least seems interesting RP wise. If I can't think of one then I don't play that concept until I can. Because you will be found out eventually whether through legit means or not.

As far as minimizing it, I tend to do a few things:
1. My character will disguise themselves when they're doing things that they wouldn't want connected to their everyday life. The disguise is "Batman", not "Bruce Wayne".
2. Completely different outfits and obviously descriptions. The dex based fighter/rogue walks around in non-magical fullplate (past 10% weight reduction). Sometimes I'll use this without the -disguise option and making use of mimic stat options to hide my PC's class for the "Bruce Wayne" identity.
3. Different login names for the disguise than the normal. Use -dissaportal too if you're feeling paranoid for tracking sites. Makes it harder to metagame the connection but it shouldn't hamper reporting as your login name is still connected to your CDKey.
4. Change typing style a bit, maybe one uses an accent. Preventing metagaming my descriptions will have a different style. Refer to different elements than the standard description, longer or shorter sentences/paragraphs, single versus double space after a period, etc.
5. With different playernames I will not inform anyone I know OOC that I'm playing that character either, either identity. I use this method to prevent bias in general but doubly so for secretive PCs.

Again though, things happen and that plan B part is crucial to not feeling like your character concept is ruined.

[Gouge Away]

It's really easy to make an honest mistake and think you know someone's name. I play one character and two or three alts and they meet hundreds of other characters in a month between them, usually just once in a group or fleeting conversation. I've thought someone told me their name before when they didn't, it happens and it's not metagaming or malice. Your secrecy may be of utmost importance to you but you can't expect everyone else (especially people you only have very casual contact with) to remember that about you. I can barely remember little details about characters mine are supposedly good friends with, forget about yet another shady human woman who joined a party I was in three weeks ago for a half hour.

This doesn't have to be a big deal. Send a nice and friendly tell saying "I didn't tell you my name" and if they're at all decent they'll say oops and move on like the name was never uttered.

I've also had people emote *you don't actually know my name* and I've emoted back *you're right, that didn't happen* in a group setting and the name exchange was considered forgotten. Some may consider that cheesy and pushing what you should do in emotes but it got the job done. There's nothing wrong with a retcon like that IMO, act like "we're all friends here" and you should get that in return.

All in all guarding your name is perfectly valid but it is a high maintenance way to play. If you're not making use of disguise you have to expect slip ups. If they're doing it maliciously that is metagaming but most of the time that isn't going to be the case. If you can handle it with good humor when the slip-ups happen so will everyone else, most of the time, and they'll be much more likely to remember this in the future.

[ReverentBlade]

People need to use disguise for this RP. Especially in larger crowds.

[magistrasa]

Xanrael's suggestions are words to live by for any bluff-focused character, for sure. (Heck, I live by some of those words even without secretive characters, I don't even tell my own husband what character I'm playing.) I've used those strategies in the past to great success. Thing is, in this case, I guess my circumstance is different in that I'm not actually playing a bluff-focused character - I was going for a general "incognito" modus operandi. I wasn't intent on flipping through disguises and identities, I was just trying not to draw attention to the character. My being disguised was done chiefly so that people would get the signal that my character was trying to keep a low profile. Not only were they not giving their name, they weren't giving *any* name. They weren't pretending to be someone they weren't, I just thought that people would find it easier to not metagame if my floating nameplate didn't have a name on it. Yet I stopped doing that because while I had the disguise I was getting randomly metagamed by strangers WAY more often than without the disguise. Ironically, I guess signalling that I don't want to draw attention to myself would draw way more attention to myself (to say nothing of the inexplicable hostility and suspicion), because everyone wants to hit that eyeball when they see the Disguised tag. Plus, I guess that's against the disguise rules, or something.

[MJmalevolent]

My policy; when is doubt, I'm sure my character forgot the name, even if I think they would recognize them

[chris a gogo]

well if your disguised as dark stranger...or hooded "x" then yes they are going to examine you and treat you as a dark/hooded figure...with suspicion and hostility...as you would the random creepy person wandering about near you.

[Tathkar Eisgrim]

I had this happen to me recently. As a player, I deliberately was not revealing the surname of my character - and was just using the first name - with the intention of doing a 'reveal' on his full name later. As a result I decided to "go with the flow" of it (on this occasion) and cast aside some historical RP intentions. Instead of looking back, I decided to step forward.

It wasn't such a big deal for this character - but it could have been if the name drop was intended for dropping a character important nugget of FR lore. In that case I would have sent a tell, corrected the player and retconned the matter.

[Seven Sons of Sin]

I think this isn't always the fault of your audience.

My previous character's name was Ro Irokon. He never said his last name. He was illiterate in Common so never wrote his name down on any messageboard. But still, somehow, people referred to him Ro Irokon.

There's a lot of characters I meet who have their actual character name as one thing, but go by something else. It's even with nicknames.

If your name is Alberto da Kezare, but 90% of the time you introduce yourself as simply "Al."

Just call yourself Al. Because people are going to inevitably call you Alberto de Kezare.

Your character name should reflect what you want the majority of the playerbase to know you as. There are so many many more characters/players than there used to be. You should be making name-recognition and name-memory as easy on your peers as possible.

So go by Al, not Alberto. And if your name is Alberto de Kezare, and you introduce yourself as Joseph - that's abusing the -disguise rules and disguise system.

edit: unless you are always ALWAYS always in the disguise system, I think it is an unreasonable and unfair burden to introduce yourself as Susie, but your character model says Trintiren, and then get mad later that you're being -yoinked. You need to be disguised for that.

I don't really think attempting to foil player/characters with names is a fruitful endeavour. Mystery and incognito can be accomplished in other manners. Duplicity, notoriety, -disguises, etc. There's certain a meta-element to being intentionally (or unreasonably) opaque about character names to avoid speedies/scries/etc. I don't know if that's the case here, but it's in terribly poor taste.

[ReverentBlade]

The above encapsulates my sentiments.

Had someone come into a tavern today and give a name totally unrelated to the name above their head.

It left me thinking...what is the fantasy here? I'm not going to remember this through the dozens of other characters that come through the tavern. Do they expect me to write it down? To me its just a signal of "don't try to invest in this character, they'll just try to play gotcha with you later". It feels antisocial.

[Party in the forest at midnight]

I actually keep track of names my character knows, and where my character learned the name. I don't want to accidentally metagame people. But, I also come from a server that didn't have a disguise system, where keeping track of names is basic RP etiquette. I write down the fake name, and real name in brackets. And then I can just search for the name any time I want to make sure my character knows it.

On a related topic, I hate it when people give fake names and then expect me to send them a speedy. Someone sent me an illusion once and signed it with a nickname, asking me to speedy them back. And there wasn't a single person on the playerlist with a name resembling the nickname they gave. I had no idea who they were!

And then there's another character with a nickname that sounds nothing like their actual name, and they only ever go by their nickname. So any time my character wanted to direct someone to them, I could only give the nickname. And nobody could ever send her a speedy because the messengers could never find her. But! She recently signed a letter, and my character saw the letter. I now know her name.

[Skibbles]

I'm having trouble understanding what happened.

Were you disguised and it was broken or did they just say your floaty when you give another name or no name?

Are the characters knowing your name familiar with yours or is this happening on first contact?

It's hard to say if it's deliberate meta gaming. I've had people give me a name that wasn't a disguise or a floaty (personally I wish people didn't do this) and it's all but impossible to remember after a week of talking to a hundred other characters. Sometimes I might have to send them a tell "what did you say your name was again?" but other times it's easy to be familiar with the character and use their floaty purely on accident simply because in the vast majority of encounters names are simply traded.

If you're trying to have a new name maybe the DMs will help with a name change.

I believe the disguise system is specifically for alter egos. It might help a ton to disguise with a specific name and personality and description that people will have a lot easier time remembering - reduce their need to check their own memory which will surely be faulty at some point leading to situations like this.

[magistrasa]

I'm having trouble understanding what happened.

I was hoping for this to less be about any specific incident (especially since there's been like five that happened to me so far) and more about the general experience of seemingly benign metagaming having an adverse effect on one's roleplay experience, with the hope of getting some grounded perspectives on those sorts of circumstances. Admittedly I should have probably phrased my opening post with better emphasis on it being a more general question, but, well, I had just woken up at the time and my head takes a few hours before it's screwed on straight.

I'd hoped I wouldn't have to get too detailed about my own experiences - not only because I'm not super keen on justifying myself or anything, but also because I don't want to call out any specific people or incidents that'll bring shame to anyone. (Which sucks because I just spent the past hour typing and editing a bunch of personal anecdotes and I got rid of it because I just don't think it's going to contribute in the way I want the conversation to go. That's an hour I could have spent being metagamed on Arelith. Tragic.)

[Nobs]

I think it would be alright in this case to actualy go ooc in game and type something like this.


///ooc/// Sorry to go ooc like this but i never told any one my name.


Im sure the people that meta gamed you at that moment with say sorry as it doesnt sound intentional.


Any DM can correct me if im wrong.

[Aelryn Bloodmoon]

I think something like the emote *Name isn't known and wasn't actually used IC* along with any other response is totally fine. If you then have someone insistently jump on it and repeatedly using your character's name despite this, I'd argue you're well within your rights IC to go into some kind of fit about "That's not my name! Stop calling me that, I don't know what foul mind magics you're trying to perform on me, but the next time you call me that I'm going to gut you like a fish."

And then deliver, because at that point someone is clearly digging in to take advantage of a mistake, and if your name not being known in-character is important, they aren't giving you any other choice. Silence them, at least for the scene (and any other scene you're in for the next 24 hours, by which time you can hopefully have a DM address the issue somehow.)

Actions have consequences, and if they're blatantly jumping down the metagame hole to put you in a bad spot IC, you aren't obligated to let them stay on the same screen (assuming you can back up your threats.)

This is, of course, assuming there isn't a DM present to handle your issue immediately.

[Gouge Away]

Maybe you also need a very noticeable warning in your description that the character doesn't share their name? That might stop some of this though I don't think it would stop it completely. Honestly if it happened five times already (and I'm not surprised it did) I'd expect it to happen ten more. It's a common mistake and you can't rely on everyone else in the community to remember your character has a special rule.

[Ninjimmy]

It's kind of a catch 22 because I've run into characters who give an alias thats nothing like their floaty name and if I run into them a week later I remember talking to them but damn if I can remember their name.

But if you disguise then some people will see that as a bigger chance to Meta game, hell they'll be more interested in finding out your real name, even though "You broke the Disguise this is actually Rando Calrissian" should mean absolutely nothing to people who don't know your character.

I think just an emote of *Never actually said their name* is your best bet. Wee bit cheesy but its the only way to cover a mistake.

[Nitro]

If your name is Alberto da Kezare, but 90% of the time you introduce yourself as simply "Al."

Just call yourself Al. Because people are going to inevitably call you Alberto de Kezare.

Also, to be fair. If you introduce yourself as Al and someone tries to send you a speedy while you're the only person on the server whose surname starts with AL, the speedy messenger will gleefully announce "Oh, you mean Alberto de Kezare?"

[Skibbles]

Okay I misunderstood a little.

I think taking some extra steps to try and mitigate confusion might help go a very long way. An alter ego disguise and a description would probably help far more than selectively giving/not giving a name and relying on other players to remember the special fact.

Even without bluff it would help people stay on track with who the character claims to be.

Sadly once the cat is out the bag it can never be put back regardless of an ooc message. I wonder if an ooc message to everyone in the area might actually make it worse.

[Skarain]

As to how to recover from the mistake. We can obviously not reverse time, but...

1.) If the scene has just happend, doing what other peoples suggest of emoting *has never actually told their name*, and to inform whoever send speedies that you have never given a name.
2.) If the damage is already done and you do not think you can reach over to all of those people, i can think two options.
3.) Stop playing the character. Give it a week, two weeks, a month. When you give no presence which people can interact with, they may forget it exists. When you return, start fresh and use the 1.) , explaining the situation to them if someone still uses your characters name.
4.) Ask DM to change your name. It requires less downtime than 3.) and it outright blocks all speedy messangers and scriers. Then you can start on a blank slate, and start using 1.)

Personally, i would also use Disguise. Even if the bluff score is 0, it still removes the floating name above your head. If people then still use your real character name, explain to them of the rules of roleplaying and basic etiquet. With the influx of new players, i would not be entirely surprised if there were those who do not even know what meta-gaming is and why is it bad.

If people are being suspicious, you can always always try to talk your way out of it. If you use normal clothing and do not hide your face, they will run out ammunition very quickly when accusing you of being suspicious. If they insist for your name, you do not have to tell them, or you can give a nickname tied to the disguise name. What if you act in a manner that makes it Them who are suspicious, going out, asking people names. Are they some kind of pervert or thief, or are they going to falsely accuse you of a crime. Or maybe you are always in a hurry, and ask if they can converse at another time.

No solution is perfect to keep people from asking your disguised name, but if you do not disguise your name, eventually someone will make the mistake of thinking they have heard it somewhere. Decide which option and hurdle you would rather go through and then stick to it?

[Skibbles]

I would add that it might not go over well to God-emote to everyone that they don't know you or your name.

Characters in question may have legitimately learned your character's name from other characters who didn't learn it legitimately. In such a case it could come off the very wrong way.

[Ninjimmy]

That's fairly context dependent, and if they did they probably want to telegraph somehow RP-wise that that's where the knowledge is coming from.
I'd assume slip-up over "Oh, they heard somewhere" unless the character is exceptionally recognisable.

[Deryliss]

Unfortunately, these things will happen.. and the worst part, its often unintentional and can spiral in ways that are hard to predict.

I used to play on a NWN RP PW back in the days, the Nelanther Isles. I ended up losing my character to an ooc /metagamey misunderstanding like this. I don't blame anyone, and it was RP'd out by all parties involved to a stellar degree.. but to this day I still feel a tiny bit resentful that it started with an ooc event.

There's no good answer, I feel.

[Arigard]

Unfortunately the limitations with the naming system (i.e your name floats above your head), means that keeping information on the down low with regards to things you write in your description is almost impossible unless you heavily invest in the bluff system.

Most people don't seem to treat it like it's a big deal, because the majority are happy to have everyone know most things about their character and so it doesn't have much impact when someone walks up and says "Oh hey there Bill Johnson!" who has never met you before, panics and then retcons an RP reason why they know the name. "Oh uh... someone mentioned you to me... >.>".

However, if you've spent weeks working on a character, trying to maintain some kind of secrecy and then suddenly you are revealed OOC, all your hard work is now effectively gone and it can really dampen your desire to play that character. Now everyone knows you, can scry you and as such your privacy is now removed.

IMO there is really only one example where names should be hard coded to be known and that is with something like the slavery system, where it makes complete RP sense that slaves would be documented for, recorded and exposed to the city they are supposed to be working for.

Unfortunately the fact is people make mistakes on the one hand because it's mechanically right in front of them and nobody really remembers everyone they have/haven't met IG and on the other there are always times when people simply just don't bother, or just treat characters like the floaty name exists IC out of laziness.

That's why it's always much better to have a hard and fast system that is black and white, like the language system. You character either knows the language, or they don't. You don't need to type *Speaks in Drow* and then hope nobody meta-games what you are saying from a language they have no idea about like In some other servers i've played on. Something like this with the naming (Where people need to actively learn names IC like languages) where characters names are concealed until they have introduced themselves to you would remove all doubt, human error and meta-gaming from the system entirely, because there would simply be no way to know who is who unless you had been either told someones name IC that then describes them and 'unlocks' the name to you if you say it to them.

- "Hey are you John? You look like John that got described to me by so and so..." - *Unlocks the first name of the character so next time you see them undisguised, you see John floating above their head*

- Character 1 "That's him right there!" *points with IC knowledge* - Name unlocks for character 2.

- "Oh John Johnson! I've heard about you!" *Unlocks first and last name, so next time you see them undisguised their name floats about their head*. - If their name is not John, they shake their head and their name remains hidden, or if they are under a bluff check you need to beat their bluff to unlock the name.

If someone was actively bluffing and you had a high spot, perhaps you might see a prompt above people "This person is acting suspiciously" so you can go and investigate. "Who are you? what are you doing here? Why are you acting so suspiciously" etc.

There could also be an option for people to simply toggle their name, as if they are happy for their reputation, or renowned to mean everyone would know it anyway. District leaders, famous warriors etc, or simply people who are happy to just allow you the RP that you may of heard of them in passing.

Something like the above would IMO be much more immersive, provide a lot more ingenuity and intrigue to the game and actually make it more powerful to hoard information, names and knowledge. It would also actively help the disguise system too, because you would become so used to seeing characters you have not personally interacted with over time "I just don't know them" that seeing someone without a name floating above their head would be normal and not an instant sign that something is wrong, unless your spot noticed something.

Something like the above is the only way IMO to achieve a consistency in RP driven narrative with regards to naming, because it's watertight and assure the only thing you know as a player is what your character knows IG. No longer would there need to be complaints about being scryed on, or metagamed etc. Literally the only way for someone to know your name would be if you'd mentioned it IC and that information had filtered through to the world.

[Apokriphos]

Speaking as someone who makes frequent use of the Arelith disguise system, I can say that it has been a source of major disappointment to realize how frequently players metagame the (disguised) aspect of your character name and use it as an excuse either to act with suspicion or simply clamp up any conversation and ignore your character's presence.

Additionally, along with the OP's aforementioned incident, PCs often will also metagame your account name in conversation as well.


These unfortunate aspects of the system make it very difficult to cultivate any true anonymity without also changing your account name unique to the persona you seek to encompass. Ideally some talented developer would come up with a way to address these issues while handling any potential for future abuse.