Melee PM questions

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Sylpheed
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Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:03 am

New to Arelith, got invited by a friend who wants me to run a character here and I just want to make a super tanky hin using PM. The cookie cutter build looks good but after asking on discord, seems like people don't recommend it at all anymore. Are there some changes that are in play I'm not aware of? Or are there just more tanky classes? I'm pretty much a novice when it comes to building, especially around arelith rules, so any help is appreciated.

satan
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by satan » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:23 pm

If you are that new you probably won't have the RPR to roll that class yet.
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Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:27 pm

satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:23 pm
If you are that new you probably won't have the RPR to roll that class yet.
That's true, I don't plan on taking it till level 12+ anyway which should be enough time to get the required RPR according to my friend. So my question still stands.

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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Shadowy Reality » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm

It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.

Divine Bard is also fairly tanky.
Basically Bard Song + Divine Shield. You can go either Paladin or Blackguard. Typical Bard25/Divine5 works, as does Bard20/Divine4/Fighter6. The good thing about these divine bards is that they actually are also quite good at hitting things, unlike the melee PM. It is overall just solid. Charisma do Saves, AC, Damage and Bard/Curse Song for buffs and debuffs. You can probably find the builds in Discord somewhere.

satan
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by satan » Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:55 pm

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:27 pm
satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:23 pm
If you are that new you probably won't have the RPR to roll that class yet.
That's true, I don't plan on taking it till level 12+ anyway which should be enough time to get the required RPR according to my friend. So my question still stands.
LOL

Maybe if your friend is a DM or a friend of a DM.

Otherwise that is very very unlikely. Realistically you are probably looking at rl months.Good luck though.
Xyxz - Goblin spider druid. RIP
Flail - Orog weapon master RIP
Krom - Half orc Barbarian RIP
Glyngolyn - Firbolg Shadowdancer RIP
Jigjog - the least industrious Kobold ACTIVE
Muck - munching on carion. ACTIVE

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm

satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:55 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:27 pm
satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:23 pm
If you are that new you probably won't have the RPR to roll that class yet.
That's true, I don't plan on taking it till level 12+ anyway which should be enough time to get the required RPR according to my friend. So my question still stands.
LOL

Maybe if your friend is a DM or a friend of a DM.

Otherwise that is very very unlikely. Realistically you are probably looking at rl months.Good luck though.
He is indeed a friend of a DM. We already discussed what the ritual will be and such. We're also going to be sinking at least 10+ hours a day into the game so I don't think it's really out of the question. Thanks for your input though~

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:08 pm

Shadowy Reality wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm
It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.

Divine Bard is also fairly tanky.
Basically Bard Song + Divine Shield. You can go either Paladin or Blackguard. Typical Bard25/Divine5 works, as does Bard20/Divine4/Fighter6. The good thing about these divine bards is that they actually are also quite good at hitting things, unlike the melee PM. It is overall just solid. Charisma do Saves, AC, Damage and Bard/Curse Song for buffs and debuffs. You can probably find the builds in Discord somewhere.
That's a shame, since we're both gonna be evil and we had discussed a story and ritual already for the character in question. If that's really the case then I may have to rethink a lot of stuff, will take the Divine bard into consideration!

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Adam Antium
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Adam Antium » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:10 pm

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:55 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:27 pm


That's true, I don't plan on taking it till level 12+ anyway which should be enough time to get the required RPR according to my friend. So my question still stands.
LOL

Maybe if your friend is a DM or a friend of a DM.

Otherwise that is very very unlikely. Realistically you are probably looking at rl months.Good luck though.
He is indeed a friend of a DM. We already discussed what the ritual will be and such. We're also going to be sinking at least 10+ hours a day into the game so I don't think it's really out of the question. Thanks for your input though~
You might not want to tell people you're leveraging DM friendship to get preferential treatment. That's kind of a bad thing.

But even without such, I managed to get 20 RPR by level 12-ish, it's not out of the question at all.

But I thought Palemaster had no requirements anymore? Does it require 20 RPR?

satan
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by satan » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:13 pm

Ok then.

Just saying regular people that aren't fast tracked will rarely see an rpr raise before level 12 of their first character, or even level 30 sometimes.

Since this player is obviously being fast tracked, disregard I guess.
Xyxz - Goblin spider druid. RIP
Flail - Orog weapon master RIP
Krom - Half orc Barbarian RIP
Glyngolyn - Firbolg Shadowdancer RIP
Jigjog - the least industrious Kobold ACTIVE
Muck - munching on carion. ACTIVE

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:17 pm

Adam Antium wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:10 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:55 pm

LOL

Maybe if your friend is a DM or a friend of a DM.

Otherwise that is very very unlikely. Realistically you are probably looking at rl months.Good luck though.
He is indeed a friend of a DM. We already discussed what the ritual will be and such. We're also going to be sinking at least 10+ hours a day into the game so I don't think it's really out of the question. Thanks for your input though~
You might not want to tell people you're leveraging DM friendship to get preferential treatment. That's kind of a bad thing.

But even without such, I managed to get 20 RPR by level 12-ish, it's not out of the question at all.

But I thought Palemaster had no requirements anymore? Does it require 20 RPR?
Yeah, it doesn't seem impossible. My friend hit 20 before he event became friends with said DM anyway, he's just here mostly to oversee a few things and also come to the wedding we'll all be attending :)

As for requirements, unless the info is outdated, it says it does require RPR of 20. Otherwise you just need to be non good and 3 levels in arcane.

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:19 pm

satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:13 pm
Ok then.

Just saying regular people that aren't fast tracked will rarely see an rpr raise before level 12 of their first character, or even level 30 sometimes.

Since this player is obviously being fast tracked, disregard I guess.
Fast tracked? I think you're mistaken, feel free to read the posts above! Anyway if you have nothing to contribute towards the melee PM questions I had, please stop bumping~

satan
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by satan » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:53 pm

Sorry. I thought this was a public forum. I have read your posts, and were you a random player without connections my post could have saved you a lot of time and headache in the long run when you realized you couldn't take your pm levels.

No need to get salty.
Xyxz - Goblin spider druid. RIP
Flail - Orog weapon master RIP
Krom - Half orc Barbarian RIP
Glyngolyn - Firbolg Shadowdancer RIP
Jigjog - the least industrious Kobold ACTIVE
Muck - munching on carion. ACTIVE

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:08 pm

satan wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:53 pm
Sorry. I thought this was a public forum. I have read your posts, and were you a random player without connections my post could have saved you a lot of time and headache in the long run when you realized you couldn't take your pm levels.

No need to get salty.
The only one salty is you, it's obvious from your responses. It's like you're upset I have friends to play with or something, but if you did read my posts it clearly states I read the cookie cutter PM melee build which implies I know the restrictions, but keep baiting I guess.

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Berried
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Berried » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:24 pm

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:03 am
Are there some changes that are in play I'm not aware of?
Shadowy Reality wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm
It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
That's a shame, since we're both gonna be evil and we had discussed a story and ritual already for the character in question. If that's really the case then I may have to rethink a lot of stuff, will take the Divine bard into consideration!
Worth noting that blackguard is an evil class, so you can still play out a variation of that ritual if you go divine bard.

Honestly I feel like your question has been answered and this thread can be locked.

Sylpheed
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Sylpheed » Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:06 pm

Berried wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:24 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:03 am
Are there some changes that are in play I'm not aware of?
Shadowy Reality wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm
It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
That's a shame, since we're both gonna be evil and we had discussed a story and ritual already for the character in question. If that's really the case then I may have to rethink a lot of stuff, will take the Divine bard into consideration!
Worth noting that blackguard is an evil class, so you can still play out a variation of that ritual if you go divine bard.

Honestly I feel like your question has been answered and this thread can be locked.
Yeah, I'm currently looking into blackguard on the side. Worst case scenario we'll both just reroll new characters and I'll make an earthkin defender I guess.

malcolm_mountainslayer
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by malcolm_mountainslayer » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:21 pm

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:06 pm
Berried wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:24 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:03 am
Are there some changes that are in play I'm not aware of?
Shadowy Reality wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm
It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
That's a shame, since we're both gonna be evil and we had discussed a story and ritual already for the character in question. If that's really the case then I may have to rethink a lot of stuff, will take the Divine bard into consideration!
Worth noting that blackguard is an evil class, so you can still play out a variation of that ritual if you go divine bard.

Honestly I feel like your question has been answered and this thread can be locked.
Yeah, I'm currently looking into blackguard on the side. Worst case scenario we'll both just reroll new characters and I'll make an earthkin defender I guess.
If your heart is sold on pale master (blackgaurd is also pretty evil) ask discord for some knight palemaster builds. (Bard/knight/palemaster). I saw a decent one floating around. Spellsword pale master might work too. I don't have time to break down said builds right now as i lack ore made fancy spread sheets.


As a side note, I understand you will be sinking 10 hours a day so its reasonable to get the rpr, but people arnt being salty about you having friends. It was initially a joke that you need to get lucky about having a DM pay attention to you to get a rpr bump and the joke was expressed that having a DM friend would help. It is not ok/good/acceptable that a DM connection is what allows one to get rpr bump faster, so telling people of your connection in this particular context may sound like a blatant admission to favouritism.

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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by malcolm_mountainslayer » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:21 pm

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:06 pm
Berried wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:24 pm
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:03 am
Are there some changes that are in play I'm not aware of?
Shadowy Reality wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:30 pm
It likely is no longer recommended because PM Bone Skin AC got nerfed to roughly half and EDK just got nerfed as well. You can still get EMA and about 3 extra AC from Bone Skin, but it is definitely not as good as it once was.
Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
That's a shame, since we're both gonna be evil and we had discussed a story and ritual already for the character in question. If that's really the case then I may have to rethink a lot of stuff, will take the Divine bard into consideration!
Worth noting that blackguard is an evil class, so you can still play out a variation of that ritual if you go divine bard.

Honestly I feel like your question has been answered and this thread can be locked.
Yeah, I'm currently looking into blackguard on the side. Worst case scenario we'll both just reroll new characters and I'll make an earthkin defender I guess.
If your heart is sold on pale master (blackgaurd is also pretty evil) ask discord for some knight palemaster builds. (Bard/knight/palemaster). I saw a decent one floating around. Spellsword pale master might work too. I don't have time to break down said builds right now as i lack ore made fancy spread sheets.


As a side note, I understand you will be sinking 10 hours a day so its reasonable to get the rpr, but people arnt being salty about you having friends. It was initially a joke that you need to get lucky about having a DM pay attention to you to get a rpr bump and the joke was expressed that having a DM friend would help. It is not ok/good/acceptable that a DM connection is what allows one to get rpr bump faster, so telling people of your connection in this particular context may sound like a blatant admission to favouritism.

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Hazard
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Hazard » Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:11 am

Sylpheed wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:06 pm
He is indeed a friend of a DM. We already discussed what the ritual will be and such.
Oh, hey. What's up? Is this where I get in line for RPR bumps?

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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Shadowy Reality » Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:41 am

Can someone lock this madness?

The question has been answered and I only see this getting worse.

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Tarkus the dog
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Tarkus the dog » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:52 pm

What is up with these answers? What is this treatment of new players?

It's not hard to get 20 RPR. Roleplay and you'll get there in no time. If it's not happening ( since you do need a DM to spot you ) then simply ask them if they'd be kind enough to look at your roleplay sometimes. That said, do you still even need 20 RPR to play a PM anymore?

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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by PeterRasta » Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:05 pm

That said, do you still even need 20 RPR to play a PM anymore?
You don't.

And there's absolutely nothing wrong with discussing a character concept prior to realising it with a DM. On the contrary, it might be quite a beneficial back and forth, as per my experience they're avid roleplayers and experienced storytellers.

I read his reply in no way as meant to imply he's fast-riding his way into an higher RPR, but rather that with his available time to sink it isn't out of the question to attain it in time if that was a requisite, and neither do I think it is.

To steer back on topic: I used to play a Melee PM, and I'll have to concur with some of the other posters above me, that whatwith the latest nerfs to the PM class, it meant a balancing of sorts for caster PMs but pretty much a death sentence for the Melee PM archetype. There are other much better (mechanical) ways to achieve an ;evil tank: build with now.
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Kuma » Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:32 pm

what is HAPPENING HERE??

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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Aodh Lazuli » Tue Oct 22, 2019 8:26 am

Kuma wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:32 pm
what is HAPPENING HERE??
I find myself asking that more generally that just this thread, these days.
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Seven Sons of Sin » Tue Oct 22, 2019 7:30 pm

I'd like to know who this DM is, personally. So I can lodge complaints.

I cannot believe we've gotten to a place where people think its appropriate to not only confess DM favouritism, but exploit it.

what the shit is this thread
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Aren
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Re: Melee PM questions

Post by Aren » Tue Oct 22, 2019 8:42 pm

The DMs don’t do favouritism. They have protocols in place to prevent this.

Right? Riight?

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