Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

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TheLastAxeman
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Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

Post by TheLastAxeman » Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:44 pm

Well, let's say I want to rp as rashemi Hathran(or smiliar witchy person from Rashemen that went for an adventure out of her motherland) and people from Arelith discord gave me advice to pick for her a Shaman class. Lore reasons are clear - connection with spirits and parts of natural world, outlook of a farseer, a magic that seems kinda odd for people of western Faerun.

D&D sourcebooks say that Hathran are using both arcane and divine magic - for example, Rashemi witch can have levels of druidess/shaman mixed with wizard/sorceress.

Is that kind of mix a thing on Arelith? I wanted to mix shaman with sorceress, but I really have no real knowledge about builds that work on Arelith mechanics.

Please, help me with your creativity and knowledge.

Thanks in advance for replies to come!
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Drowble Oh Seven
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Re: Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

Post by Drowble Oh Seven » Sun Sep 20, 2020 1:03 am

First up, welcome!

Mixing caster classes does not generally play well with how NWN's set up, unfortunately. Some of the reasons are detailed in this thread, where Chaosrook was looking for a druid/wizard.

There's a whole lot of dispel and spell-scaling issues that ultimately make a heavily cross-classed caster - Well. A little like pulling your own fingernails out, to play.

My advice would be to run with, say, a shaman - But there's nothing stopping you investing in lore and use magic device (via a bard dip, typically) to get access to arcane stuff for RP purposes. Something like a 27 Shaman / 3 Bard (for discipline, use magic device) would be in keeping with the old way of building casters - I freely admit that I haven't looked at Shaman explicitly. Even a 27 Shaman / 3 Sorcerer is serviceable*, as long as you're aware those sorc levels will be exclusively for familiar access and a bit of flavour, and don't expect the spells to actually do anything. Nor is there anything stopping you from roleplaying your character as augmenting their shamanistic magic with an understanding of arcane magic.

Opinions'll differ here, but I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with stretching the concept of the base class just a little bit, to make it work with an interesting character idea.

If you're looking to do a bit of build-tweaking yourself, the wiki has a list of builds that's a good starting resource. If nothing else, it'll give you an idea of how they're usually put together, so you can get a feel for how far any adjustments you want to make are from the norm.

*I say 'serviceable' here in the sense that you'll have powerful spells and be able to contribute comfortably on adventures. There's still a lot of vulnerabilities you'll introduce to the build from a player-vs-player standpoint doing dips like this. But majority casters (by which I mean, 26+ main caster levels, typically) won't have any issues adventuring.

Gouge Away
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Re: Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

Post by Gouge Away » Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:22 am

You can also add divine flavor to sorcerer in a few different ways, like adding blackguard levels or taking gift of devotion.

But yeah in most cases you need to pick one casting class and go 26-30 levels in it. That's just how NWN and Arelith are.

The thing is we're all in the same boat and nobody expects you to be mechanically unique or frankly even appreciates it that much if you are. It's how you RP that matters. You could play the same character you describe as a sorcerer, favored soul, shaman, cleric even a spellsword, warlock or bard.. Just pick the class abilities and spell selection that appeals to you and work with it.

If you're new you should probably also run with a recommended build and stick to it because there are a lot of non-intuitive issues in the game that you probably wouldn't think of when coming up with something unique on your own (like how dispelling works for example)

Seven Sons of Sin
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Re: Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

Post by Seven Sons of Sin » Mon Sep 21, 2020 2:09 pm

The hathran are much more mechanically represented as an arcane caster than a divine (even shaman). Typically, "witches" in Dungeons and Dragons have followed the idea of casting arcane spells (like magic missile) rather than divine (healing).

I would also use an arcane caster to represent the hathran for a few of the cultural reasons:

> the hathran are meant to go toe-to-toe with Red Wizards of Thay, these spell duels seem better expressed through arcane magic
> male magic users (of the arcane) are not allowed in Rashemen, which seems to suggest women are primarily arcane
> rune-scarred beserkers (the protectors of hathran) are... rune-scarred, and that kind of rune magic originates from arcane traditions

But, yeah, the hathran are an example of something you wish you could Mystic Theurge (a divine/arcane spellcaster). Unfortunately, we don't have that here.

My suggestion would be a wizard or sorcerer for 26 levels, and then maybe dip Healer cleric if you're dead-set on divine expression, but otherwise can simply invest a lot in Heal, carry healing scrolls, and express respect for divine stuff through roleplay.
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Kalgoon
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Re: Shaman + sorceress = Hathran?

Post by Kalgoon » Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:22 pm

If you ever played or look up Baldur's Gate, there was a witch in training on a dajemma. Her name was Dynaheir and she was an invoker, which is a specialist Wizard.

Male arcane spellcasters in Rashemen actually have one of two options: join the Vremmyoni (Old Ones) to craft magic items for their country and rarely help their sisters in magical combat or choose exile, never to return home and have their secret knowledge stripped from them.

I feel the main reason you want to go Nature or Divine is the connection with the spirits of the land. You could do the typical 27/3 caster with Ranger dip, to skill dump Animal Empathy.

I also hope you would consider why she left her home and her family behind. For more lore: https://realmshelps.net/faerun/rashemen/people.shtml

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