medium weapons look too small now for large races

[Tarkus the dog]

could this be reversed? i feel like large races are pressured into using large/huge weapons now to avoid looking goofy. my scimitar firbolg looks silly and this isn't what i signed up for when i spent a major on the character.

just to note, the medium weapons looked fine before. the recent update made them smaller. im not jealous of my minotaur brethren.

[l33tfragiletings]

That feeling when a scimitar looks like a butter knife cause it's being used by a Firbolg, hopefully they reverse it! Looks a bit strange the way it is now.

[Morgy]

As I understand it, this is just a temporary thing until a new weapon 'size' is updated to the module. Hang tight.

[l33tfragiletings]

Cool, thanks Morgy!

[Painus]

if it's a temporary thing in place to prepare for the real thing

...

why not just wait and add the real thing later so it's not a goofy half-measure

[Tarkus the dog]

As I understand it, this is just a temporary thing until a new weapon 'size' is updated to the module. Hang tight.

[Good Character]

New weapon class already dropped. It's "Huge" weapons; they act as 2-handers for large races. Info is on the Discord.

[Richrd]

When returning to Arelith I have not met a single firbolg who managed to give me actual firbolg vibes. To me they just all seemed like ten-XL humans. And I do not think that this is an unfair opinion to have either when nearly all firbolgs I met either behaved like a human, wore heavy armor like humans or were mainly interested in money and riches and basically spat on everything firbolgs should be standing for. The first few times I encountered one of them I wasn't even sure about what was in front of me, I thought Arelith had introduced growth spells or that my game bugged out. Until I checked their descriptions.

Now is this a subjective opinion? Yesn't. Because on one side it's all just my own preference for what I'd like to see from firbolg RP. On the other we even have Arelith's own wiki clearly explaining what firbolgs are. And my expectations of firbolgs are in line with what the wiki describes.

Now how is this related to the current topic? Simple. If normal-sized weapons look stupid on firbolgs and they're forced into using clearly firbolg-sized equipment? That's a plus in my book. Something to make them more distinct from humans.
What counts as a small sized weapon to a humanoid is tiny to a firbolg. And on it goes for all other weapon sizes too.

[xf1313]

I find that amusing? Being a big race would have that issue, weapons too small

[Kalopsia]

Something to keep in mind here is that due to being medium sized, bastard swords count as concealable weapons for Firbolgs and other large races. The displayed size in game should be consistent with mechanics like these.

The goal with this update was to make greatswords look like longswords for huge races - because essentially that's what they are.

The weapon scaling factors might need some refinement, though. I'll make sure to give affected races a closer look and adjust things to look better this weekend. 100% scaling across the board was a good initial value, but some large races could do with 10% larger weapons or something. I'll also check out half-orcs while I'm at it.

[Waldo52]

Something to keep in mind here is that due to being medium sized, bastard swords count as concealable weapons for Firbolgs and other large races. The displayed size in game should be consistent with mechanics like these.

The goal with this update was to make greatswords look like longswords for huge races - because essentially that's what they are.

The weapon scaling factors might need some refinement, though. I'll make sure to give affected races a closer look and adjust things to look better this weekend. 100% scaling across the board was a good initial value, but some large races could do with 10% larger weapons or something. I'll also check out half-orcs while I'm at it.

While you're talking about half-orcs and scaling...

The half orc frame looks terrible. It's a Neverwinter problem and not an arelith problem, but you have "half orc" guards in Andunor who use the human body phenotype. Could we please get this option? I'm dying to play an orc that doesn't look like a green chicken nugget.

[Atlus]

I am playing a max height half-orc at the moment as my only character and I feel their weapon resizing has been a bit aggressive. Small weapons clip through their grips and larger weapons feel absolutely spindly/inappropriately fitted to the race's chunky fists. I understand the intent but NWN and D&D itself was not tuned as a completely realistic or historical fantasy and slightly exaggerated weapon size gives a nice sense of readability in gameplay as well.

This change also disregards that large characters might be wanting to be able to play with weapons with certain shapes and profiles that are scaled up to fit their hands, thus robbing some larger races of appropriately oversized scimitars and similar weapons visually.

If I had any clue what the percentile scale of previous weapons were I'd give a more earnest suggestion of how to amend this, but otherwise I just desire the original larger scaling I had on my half-orc's nodachi.

[Alyxnia]

If I had any clue what the percentile scale of previous weapons were I'd give a more earnest suggestion of how to amend this, but otherwise I just desire the original larger scaling I had on my half-orc's nodachi.

Agreed 100% with this post, but for my Orog and his weapons. If I wanted my sword to be human-sized I would have played a human and not an Orog. I can't imagine how scuffed it feels to be a firbolg/ogre/minotaur right now.

[Arienette]

I equipped a scimitar on my brand new Minotaur (because the new huge weapons don’t seem to actually be available yet) and the various parts of the hilt disappeared and it looked like I was grasping the blade.

[Dreams]

Firbolg weapon sizes look exactly right. Ogres probably need slight adjustment but it could just be the terrible models they have in general. You could probably do something like a +/- 5% based on medium sized creatures being the normal, with exceptions where needed visually.

e.g.
Halfling - Small - -5% to all weapons
Human - Medium - 0% change
Half-orc - Medium - +5% all weapons
Ogre - Large - +5% to all weapons

Additional +/- % based on how tall the person is. Weapons are often made to fit a person, swords have different lengths that aren't all uniform - usually tailor made for a particular person or size!

[Brandon Steel]

I ran into an ogre NPC yesterday and the sword he was wielding was so comically small, it just looked ridiculous. I really hope this either gets reverted or the sizes get tweaked.

[Tarkus the dog]

Firbolg weapon sizes look exactly right. Ogres probably need slight adjustment but it could just be the terrible models they have in general. You could probably do something like a +/- 5% based on medium sized creatures being the normal, with exceptions where needed visually.

e.g.
Halfling - Small - -5% to all weapons
Human - Medium - 0% change
Half-orc - Medium - +5% all weapons
Ogre - Large - +5% to all weapons

Additional +/- % based on how tall the person is. Weapons are often made to fit a person, swords have different lengths that aren't all uniform - usually tailor made for a particular person or size!

this frankly looks ridiculous and is nothing what my character used to look like.

Something to keep in mind here is that due to being medium sized, bastard swords count as concealable weapons for Firbolgs and other large races. The displayed size in game should be consistent with mechanics like these.

The goal with this update was to make greatswords look like longswords for huge races - because essentially that's what they are.

The weapon scaling factors might need some refinement, though. I'll make sure to give affected races a closer look and adjust things to look better this weekend. 100% scaling across the board was a good initial value, but some large races could do with 10% larger weapons or something. I'll also check out half-orcs while I'm at it.

why was it decided for this change to happen now and not when large races were initially introduced? to have to accept that your character looks silly all of the sudden is not okay, especially considering we're talking about a major reward ( or greater in other cases ). this is not what my character has looked like for it's entire existence and id appreciate if i the player got to choose it's appearance and not the developers. i dont want to need to re-brand my toon into a large/huge weapon user simply to avoid looking goofy. nobody should be railed into doing that.

i will concur that yes larger weapons while one handed by large races looked a bit out of order but i dont think us who dont want to use large weapons should feel the need to want to swap to them. my character has absolutely no reason to swap to a large weapon and yet i feel like i'll have to do so just to keep the old appearance.

kindly allow us to choose whether our characters prefer rogue style sized weapons or not ( given this is what i signed up for when i made the character ), and if we're talking realism i should mention that kukris appear as large as scimitars and yet fall into the tiny category ( please dont shrink kukris next ).

[AstralUniverse]

No please keep it. my half orc buddy is laughable with that toothpick (two-sided sword)

[Brandon Steel]

Ok but actually, why is this even needed? I understand that new weapons are being added, but was it really an issue before that weapons were proportionally sized to how big the models were? A bastard sword looked like a great sword on an ogre, so what? The assumption was always that the weapon was made with the creature in mind or the “bastard sword” was just a “great sword” in all but mechanics, it was just RPed accordingly. I just feel like this was such a silly update that served nothing other than to waste someones time coding it while angering everyone who’s character now looks ridiculous.

[Dreams]

Firbolg weapon sizes look exactly right. Ogres probably need slight adjustment but it could just be the terrible models they have in general. You could probably do something like a +/- 5% based on medium sized creatures being the normal, with exceptions where needed visually.

e.g.
Halfling - Small - -5% to all weapons
Human - Medium - 0% change
Half-orc - Medium - +5% all weapons
Ogre - Large - +5% to all weapons

Additional +/- % based on how tall the person is. Weapons are often made to fit a person, swords have different lengths that aren't all uniform - usually tailor made for a particular person or size!

this frankly looks ridiculous and is nothing what my character used to look like.

Something to keep in mind here is that due to being medium sized, bastard swords count as concealable weapons for Firbolgs and other large races. The displayed size in game should be consistent with mechanics like these.

The goal with this update was to make greatswords look like longswords for huge races - because essentially that's what they are.

The weapon scaling factors might need some refinement, though. I'll make sure to give affected races a closer look and adjust things to look better this weekend. 100% scaling across the board was a good initial value, but some large races could do with 10% larger weapons or something. I'll also check out half-orcs while I'm at it.

why was it decided for this change to happen now and not when large races were initially introduced? to have to accept that your character looks silly all of the sudden is not okay, especially considering we're talking about a major reward ( or greater in other cases ). this is not what my character has looked like for it's entire existence and id appreciate if i the player got to choose it's appearance and not the developers. i dont want to need to re-brand my toon into a large/huge weapon user simply to avoid looking goofy. nobody should be railed into doing that.

i will concur that yes larger weapons while one handed by large races looked a bit out of order but i dont think us who dont want to use large weapons should feel the need to want to swap to them. my character has absolutely no reason to swap to a large weapon and yet i feel like i'll have to do so just to keep the old appearance.

kindly allow us to choose whether our characters prefer rogue style sized weapons or not ( given this is what i signed up for when i made the character ), and if we're talking realism i should mention that kukris appear as large as scimitars and yet fall into the tiny category ( please dont shrink kukris next ).

You’re right, using a scimitar looks tiny. That’s because you’re playing a big firbolg. Try using a falchion, or some other curved blade like a cavalry sword.

Cav sword + Shortsword works well as a short sword/dagger combo for a firbolg. Great sword makes for an excellent longsword/bastard sword appearance for one too in terms of size.

[Tarkus the dog]

are you purposefully missing my point that this wasn't the case for months but now we're asked to adjust out of the blue to avoid the funny look?

[Richrd]

are you purposefully missing my point that this wasn't the case for months but now we're asked to adjust out of the blue to avoid the funny look?

I mean maybe that's the case, maybe you do indeed now have to adjust out of the blue.

Like with anything that gets adjusted. Consider this a visual nerf then.

[Tarkus the dog]

are you purposefully missing my point that this wasn't the case for months but now we're asked to adjust out of the blue to avoid the funny look?

I mean maybe that's the case, maybe you do indeed now have to adjust out of the blue.

Like with anything that gets adjusted. Consider this a visual nerf then.

there is a difference between mechanical change in pursuit of healthy gameplay and a visual change in pursuit of aesthetics or whatever it is that the developers have in mind for the server.

much as orogs would be vexed if they were scaled down to half-orc size once again i am vexed that my firbolg's weapon has been shrunk and im sure this is something you can empathize with at the very least instead of simply telling others to accept it and move on.

it is very easy to do so especially when the change doesn't affect you directly but if you were to put yourself in the shoes of the affected you might notice similar annoyances.

yes of course my character can swap to a falchion, a greataxe or a greatsword but they are known as someone using a scimitar and not a large weapon. also consider that this weapon i've invested into and i'll have to invest into another if i want to choose visuals over mechanics/convenience.

we shouldn't be telling eachother to simply accept things we've heavily invested into but instead to try and meet half-way at the very least. i'll understand if you disagree with me but given enough time same might happen to you/one your characters ( or has already happened ) at which point i wonder if you give yourself the same advice, to just accept it.

with that out of the way im going to ask this thread to be locked as i didnt know a small annoyance would need to have me writing paragraphs in order to express myself and i dont see it going anywhere positive from here on.

[Richrd]

with that out of the way im going to ask this thread to be locked as i didnt know a small annoyance would need to have me writing paragraphs in order to express myself and i dont see it going anywhere positive from here on.

It's a bit sudden to say that this isn't going anywhere positive when all that's happened is just a few people disagreeing with how all the weapons need to be specifically resized on large races.

I went onto Arelith's test server and took a look at the sword type weaponry at least because that's the one where I imagine the position of the hand to be the most crucial due to the crossguards.

I am playing with an improved hand model from the workshop because I frankly hate the cube-hand look of the base game. So that totally could screw my perspective on things over. But here's the pics, all taken with a maximum height firbolg.


Greatsword? Looking about the same size as a bastard sword for any medium sized PC.


Longsword. Can't say that it's such a big change as with the greatsword. I'd say if compared to a medium sized PC's longsword this lands between the middle and small weapon sizes.


Now the shortsword is almostperfect IMHO. It's size looks exactly like what one would expect a firbolg-sized dagger to look like, only the position of the hand has some slight clipping. An issue that's probably worse with the base cube-hand models.

[Mattamue]

We need to see these with the cube hand to really judge aesthetics.