Obsidian Asylum

Feedback relating to the other areas of Arelith, also includes old topics.


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Maladus
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Obsidian Asylum

Post by Maladus » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:36 am

So this infamous puzzle tower is both one of my favorite areas in the entire server, and one I found the most frustrating before someone walked my character through the puzzles in game. It is one of the oldest zones on the server having remained largely in tact in its current iteration for as long as I can remember.

However, if you don't know the method needed to solve the puzzles, you have no way of finding out save find someone who knows (which granted is fairly common) to have them walk you through it. Generally this isn't a bad thing, but considering FOIG is sort of a mantra of the server, I find that part somewhat disconcerting.

Technically asking around IS finding out in game, but it may not be as satisfying as discovering the answers on your own. It would be nice if there was some means by which someone who is completely new to the area would be able to figure it out for themselves.

On there other hand, perhaps most people do figure it out and I'm just bad at solving puzzles so I wasn't able to do it myself all those years ago. Then again, I just had at conversation with someone who was stuck at the third door.

Anyone else have thoughts to add?

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by msterswrdsmn » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:08 am

The cave with the swamp puzzle is worse. I never figured it out, personally. I know a few people that did, but there weren't any clues, patterns, or consistancy behind it that I could figure out. And each failed attempted would spam me with disease/poison, so there was a limit as to how many times I could attempt it before burning through enough healing items to go "yep, this isn't worth it".

The Obsidian Asylum isn't terrible, to my recollection, though it is potentially inaccessible to certain classes. Unless something has changed, to my knowledge? I don't think i've been through the thing in about 10 RL years (again, around when it was first made) so my memory is very, very fuzzy.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Pippo » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:36 am

The hint to the first gate for the obsidian asylum can be found in game without having to ask around, and even my fighter/WM managed to pass it. But I didn't get further than that.

As for the Halls of madness (the cave in the swamp), I powered through the first two, but then I got completely stuck.
I've checked a lot of books, but maybe not enough...

I love exploring dungeons and puzzles, but this stuff is really hard!

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by -XXX- » Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:27 am

Large dungeons with runic chests cater to achievers.
Cities and the settlement system cater to socializers.
The intricate gear and build dynamic caters to killers.
Frustratingly difficult puzzles cater to explorers.

I think that we need more of this. It's not like the solution to the puzzles would be some jealously guarded secret.
On the contrary - there's no bigger reward for an explorer than being able to share a solution with someone IC.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Aodh Lazuli » Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:37 am

-XXX- wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:27 am
Large dungeons with runic chests cater to achievers.
Cities and the settlement system cater to socializers.
The intricate gear and build dynamic caters to killers.
Frustratingly difficult puzzles cater to explorers.
Is this some sort of gamer-centric Meyers-Briggs Type Indicator? I tend to think most players are rather harder to classify with any degree of accuracy. Due to being people, we have a remarkable ability to change in response to our environment.

That aside, the Obsidian Tower puzzles are puzzles I actually rather enjoyed the first time I went there. This is quite unlike the "puzzle" in the Tomb of the Last King, for example, where the clues in game are actively misleading, rather than cryptically pointing to the solution.
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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Rico_scorpion » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:05 am

"Achiever Killer Explorer Socializer"

Is one way to classify "main" players behaviors (there are other more unnecessary complex ones/more precise ones, but a forum is hardly the place for academical works). Note that they are not meant to be exclusive, a player is a blend of all of these. Some people are only one, some are a bit of two, some are all four, etc, there's as many possible blends are there are players, but at the end of the day, most known player behaviors should fall into one of these. It's particulary true on Arelith, where this analytical tool is particularly adapted (when approached as blends rather than exclusive categories).

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by -XXX- » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:19 am

Aodh Lazuli wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:37 am
Is this some sort of gamer-centric Meyers-Briggs Type Indicator? I tend to think most players are rather harder to classify with any degree of accuracy. Due to being people, we have a remarkable ability to change in response to our environment.
It's a Bartle's taxonomy reference that tells us how most players have a clear preference for play styles in a multiplayer environment.
While it's true that humans have a remarkable capacity to adapt, there's only so much a game can ask from them before it fails to deliver what they wanted from it in the first place.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Kuma » Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:24 am

The Asylum is 100% doable without being shown the answers. I did it precisely like that, like, a decade ago.

The puzzles are in fact too simple, tbh, in my opinion. The Aisles of Insanity are worse, and just need brute forced instead.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Aren » Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:31 am

Kuma wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:24 am
The Asylum is 100% doable without being shown the answers. I did it precisely like that, like, a decade ago.

The puzzles are in fact too simple, tbh, in my opinion. The Aisles of Insanity are worse, and just need brute forced instead.
I too had the satisfaction unlocking the secrets of the Obsidian Asylum on my own - granted I was shown the asylums location by Arnold Von Kroest, who proceeded to follow me around as I figured out the puzzles. I think we spent 3-4 hours in there.
Good times.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Skald Haldi » Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:32 pm

The point isn't whether the puzzle is too hard or too easy.
Sometimes you get lucky on hard things, and sometimes you get stuck on something dumb.
When someone gets stuck, "FOIG" should not necessarily mean "go pester somebody".
It is more satisfying to find the right book in a library or talk to an NPC... or something

There's good RP when a player tells you "you need to go find such-and-such tome that describes the Asylum"
That's also a lot neater than someone saying "Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Select, Start"

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Maladus
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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Maladus » Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:19 pm

Skald Haldi wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:32 pm
The point isn't whether the puzzle is too hard or too easy.
Sometimes you get lucky on hard things, and sometimes you get stuck on something dumb.
When someone gets stuck, "FOIG" should not necessarily mean "go pester somebody".
It is more satisfying to find the right book in a library or talk to an NPC... or something

There's good RP when a player tells you "you need to go find such-and-such tome that describes the Asylum"
That's also a lot neater than someone saying "Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Select, Start"
This is exactly the point I was trying to get across in my original post. Furthermore, just because you or someone else you know did it on you own doesn't mean the experience can't be improved for others.

Also, if the Aisles of Madness is the cave I'm thinking it is, then yes. It too should be reworked or updated in such a way that you can find clues as to how to solve it.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Nitro » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:27 pm

I think the Obsidian Asylum is a perfect example of how difficult a "puzzle dungeon" should be. All of the puzzles have hints present or nearby in the area and don't require any huge leaps of logic to reach the correct conclusion.

Unlike the Aisles of Madness.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Curve » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:15 pm

Kuma wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:24 am
The Asylum is 100% doable without being shown the answers. I did it precisely like that, like, a decade ago.

The puzzles are in fact too simple, tbh, in my opinion. The Aisles of Insanity are worse, and just need brute forced instead.
Yeah, I did the puzzle when I was like five years old. I have a really high iq tho.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by RedGiant » Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:42 am

I found the Aisles to be the easier of the two.

The Asylum, to me at least, had one portion that was not intuitive at all, but was ultimately solveable.

There are a goodly many other areas cordoned off by secrets and/or puzzles.

I dont think any of these require a rework. In fact, I would like to see more puzzles like this in game. I've been playing here since about 08', and Im still finding stuff, which is part of Arelith's magic.

In short:
Please don't dumb these down. Check your lore.
These are all very doable.
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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Blood on my Lips » Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:42 am

My first trip through the Obsidian Asylum was a "test" by another character to see if my character was worthy of his mentoring. I was able to figure out all the puzzles on my own and I was still a new player back then. It was fun not being simply told what to do. I found plenty of hints in the Asylum to work out all the puzzles.

And that's me. I'm not claiming it's going to be easy for everyone. The Aisles of Insanity puzzle was hard for me. I've seen a lot of people struggle with that one.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by TimeAdept » Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:49 pm

Aisles was a brute force puzzle that I still don't understand, a basic theological test, and a test of 'can you use context clues'. Beyond the first, I never found it difficult.

Obsidian Asylum is pretty good.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Kuma » Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:36 am

Curve wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:15 pm
Yeah, I did the puzzle when I was like five years old. I have a really high iq tho.
nice bro

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Skibbles » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:35 am

Seems like everyone remembers their first time there which is a big plus. Mine was years ago.

I found one part of it, the shelf, to be the hardest because I didn't know FR like the back of my hand and literally didn't know what the answer was even after being told and had to look it up. This is the part where most people I showed through (which isn't a huge number) struggled with as it does seem very unintuitive.

The shelf was the only part I personally needed help with if I recall, but I don't think there's any amount of clues that can help people that not only are new to Arelith but just Forgotten Realms in general.
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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Xarge VI » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:09 am

I had much more trouble with Obsidian Asylum than with aisles of insanity. Weird that so many think otherwise.

Personally I'd like to see more puzzles like that. The infuriating feeling of not knowing how that damn door opens raargh adds to the mystery of the server.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Might-N-Magic » Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:21 pm

The biggest problem with the Asylum is that lorewise, the power supposedly venerated definitely shouldn't and wouldn't be giving you what it does.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Dachlatte » Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:10 am

The Asylum and the Aisles are both masterpieces.

Another one is the Minogon Plant. And I think this one is unmatched.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Nitro » Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:39 am

I'd like the minogon plant more if some of the puzzles didn't bug out and eat the necessary items to no effect half of the time

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by Diegovog » Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:57 am

I found the aisles easier and the last puzzles made sense. The bookshelf puzzle in the obsidian doesn't imo.

For those who enjoy puzzles and difficult dungeons there's the minogon plant, which can be brutal.

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Re: Obsidian Asylum

Post by msterswrdsmn » Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:01 pm

On a semi-related note, is Derro dungeon entrance puzzle still bugging out? Last time I tried doing that puzzle, some of the interaction points related to the puzzle pieces were physically broken, making it impossible to complete.

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