Add a Slave Caller to Guldorand Server

[Wenchslayer]

Right now, a slave can just run to Guldorand and therefore, be unable to be recalled. This defeats the point of a slave collar in the first place.

Please add a slave holding outpost in Guldorand somewhere that you can use to call a runaway slave.

This isn't about if slavery is reasonable, or unreasonable, or a broken or intended to start a debate. This is just pointing out the current system of apprehending slaves has a very obvious and blatant flaw. With this current flaw, I see little to no point in owning a slave as a player character.

[Morgy]

PC slaves should have a refuge point they can go to, as it also allows some extra RPing of escape, which is a legitimate RP arc. Guldorand isn't a vastly busy server and this might also at least bring some more RP to that area, as a side point. Also, having the ability to call a slave from anywhere, might make sense ooc, but IC it allows for a bit more of an 'escape story'.

'With this current flaw, I see little to no point in owning a slave as a player character.'

Perhaps you shouldn't be taking slave PCs if this 'flaw' means you can't see any other point. As a regular UD/slave player, I can tell you that there's plenty of ways to keep a slave under control, if the player wants to be creative. It's happening regularly at the moment.

You can try to hunt, blackmail or spy on a slave you suspect of escaping to Guldorand.. Punish their kin, friends.. Find them in person.. etc, etc.. Can you really only rely on the caller mechanic? The vast majority of areas are covered by callers already, so slave PCs have a very limited point of safety.

[Ebonstar]

Right now, a slave can just run to Guldorand and therefore, be unable to be recalled. This defeats the point of a slave collar in the first place.

Please add a slave holding outpost in Guldorand somewhere that you can use to call a runaway slave.

This isn't about if slavery is reasonable, or unreasonable, or a broken or intended to start a debate. This is just pointing out the current system of apprehending slaves has a very obvious and blatant flaw. With this current flaw, I see little to no point in owning a slave as a player character.

um maybe you need to create more RP so your slaves dont run away??

[Babylon System is the Vampire]

Seems like a legit point.

[Nekonecro]

agreed.

[Skarain]

Since lst Monster Races/UDers are not allowed on Sibayad, that place already exists as a refuge for slave PCs. In that sense,Guld being safe is nothing new.

Plus, it can generate some nice RP if you hire someone to go fetch your slave back.

[Drowboy]

If someone doesn't want to play with you to the point that they figure out the one place you literally can't get to them, uh, that sounds like a you problem, not a system one. Like. Reread what you posted with some distance, maybe.

(Also "I feed your name to an npc I am expert slave catcher" is about the top level of rp this system brings in, huh?)

[Wenchslayer]

Good Roleplay -/- mechanical flaws.

Part of what facilitates roleplay is effective mechanics to ensure that certain outcomes are incentivized or disincentivized. This is also a videogame, not just a roleplaying server. Spellswords were just as fun to 'roleplay' before their changes, but I see far more of them now that they had an update and feel much more engaging to play.

In the current state of the slavery system, oversights like this mean that people won't use the system. If the system is bad, that will in turn effect the number of players willing to use or engage with the system.

I think the slavery system is bad. It needs an update, or at least small bandaid fixes like this. I don't want to have to shoe-horn my roleplay in. I'd rather it just worked effectively as intended.

It's very obvious that the slavery system is in need of an update, for this was never an issue before the introduction of the Guldorand server, and back when people could summon slaves at Sibiayad regardless of race. Every single server had a slave caller or some sort of location you could retrieve a slave from. It's a mechanical oversight. At this point, just scrap the system entirely or at least fix it to where it was working like back in 2019.

This thread has nothing to do with if a player is 'fun' or not to roleplay with. I, but I hear it time and time again. "X Mechanic doesn't matter if you are good at roleplay!' It still is a gaping mechanical hole that will incentivize certain outcomes.

There's always an effective, consistent way to avoid people that are seen as not fun to be around. Having a poorly functioning mechanic doesn't really change that truth. If people don't like being enslaved, they just don't have to opt in, or they can talk to a DM. We don't need to exploit an aging mechanic to get a desired result in this case.

[Mattamue]

The very obvious mechanical and RP club of a collar summon doesn't work in this one case and that means there's no reason for the entire system?

This isn't the argument for fixing a flaw in the slavery system that you think it is.

[chris a gogo]

What it is is an exploit of an existing system.
A while back I was with a group that captured a prisoner, the player was fine with the capture and more than happy to go along with getting a prisoner collar, shortly after while walking back he got yoinked away the went to the guld server and couldn't be recalled.
Made perfect IC sense for them to go there as they were a guard of the settlement but this then ended the role play, not because they escaped but because the server is split over multiple servers so a mechanic to prevent such escaping can be bypassed, not and lets be clear here because Guldorand is a safe location for slaves.

[-XXX-]

It sure seems to me like a conflict between the
"I wore a collar for 5 seconds before running off to a safe haven and now I'm Spartacus"
vs.
"I can just talk to this NPC to rollplay"

Once again a slavery mechanic related problem with no right answers.

[AstralUniverse]

Maybe instead, how about remove all slave callers.

[Algol]

Perhaps slave callers could be changed with slave retrievers. When talked to it marks the slave that you want and may cause to nasty hostile slave hunters mobs to spawn to recapture the slave in the wilderness.

[Nekonecro]

or maybe... just maybe..
crazy idea here.

Do a little of that RP thing and get some players involved in retrieving the slave?

[Watchful Glare]

It does seem like an oversight that Guldorand doesn't have one, just like (I think) Guldorand doesn't have entry portals from the halls of Kelemvor in case someone wants to raise you in Guldorand.

What is up with the "Well if a slave wants to escape it's because your RP wasn't good, meanie ):<" posts, sheesh. It's like the Stormwind fallacy. Your RP can be good, and the slave's player can both love that and still try their best to escape like their character would. Things are not mutually exclusive. Let's dial it down a bit.

[D4wN]

If you think the slave caller not being in Guld is an issue, you probably also have an issue with slaves who have bluff/perform and can just hide themselves from the caller. Because with that, even being on the UD server you could never find them.

Slaves will and should try and find safety and/or freedom if they are being mistreated or play that they don't want to be enslaved.

Be more creative. Involve other players, drive some fun conflict and create a story everyone can enjoy. There are plenty of ways you can hunt, chase or punish slaves who seek refuge in Guldorand. Not an oversight at all imo. Relying too heavily on mechanics and letting yourself be limited by that is never a good idea.

[Morgy]

Be more creative. Involve other players, drive some fun conflict and create a story everyone can enjoy. There are plenty of ways you can hunt, chase or punish slaves who seek refuge in Guldorand. Not an oversight at all imo. Relying too heavily on mechanics and letting yourself be limited by that is never a good idea.

If I had a player enacting RP to hunt my PC or hiring goons to drag them back, I would personally 100% be more likely to drag the arc out far longer. It would be a far more engrossing story than a forced yoink. Don’t get me wrong, I think having that function is a good tool for threatening slave safety the majority of the time.. but having the option to avoid it somewhat and explore other avenues of being re-captured is more exciting.

We can, the majority of the time, overlook mechanical sense for what creates more compelling stories, imo. I’m not saying ignore mechanical flaws if you can cover it with RP. What I’m saying in this case I don’t think it’s a flaw actually, I think it just helps create more RP options.

On another point - does CnP have a caller? I can't think of it if so.. and if not, then slaves have already been able to hide in Cordor/Shadow Plane for years, which are far more popular locations combined on the whole.

[Skarain]

Dis has a slave caller, and Dis is on C&P.

[-XXX-]

If I had a player enacting RP to hunt my PC or hiring goons to drag them back, I would personally 100% be more likely to drag the arc out far longer.

You see, what you're describing here sure seems to me like enjoying a conflict situation while having 100% control with a finger hovering above the win button ready to push it on a whim the entire time. I'm not surprised that you'd be eager to drag that out, especially when it also happens to fuel your toon's story and agenda.

Don't get me wrong, I think that the slave caller introduces the same dynamic by giving the control to the other side.

Which is why I think that the slave system just doesn't work - it puts all the cards into one person't hand in either case.
It requires a great deal of trust and understanding between all involved parties to actually work. At that point any mechanical enforcement becomes redundant.

[Morgy]

If I had a player enacting RP to hunt my PC or hiring goons to drag them back, I would personally 100% be more likely to drag the arc out far longer.

You see, what you're describing here sure seems to me like enjoying a conflict situation while having 100% control with a finger hovering above the win button ready to push it on a whim the entire time. I'm not surprised that you'd be eager to drag that out, especially when it also happens to fuel your toon's story and agenda.

I'm not sure how you can infer that from what I said. Please explain.

If people put effort into capture/slavery/anything story from their side, I'm far more willing to sacrifice my PC's chance at being successful at something. That is the point I am making here.

[-XXX-]

Character gets collared, then runs off to "hiding" to a safe haven.

Sure, rumor that their masters have hired goons to drag them back might make the situation more immersive, but truth remains that they are extremely unlikely to succeed without the runaway's player active contribution to make that actually happen.

In the meantime the character earns extra attention points - which is why I believe many players act jaded toward escaped collared characters.
It's usually little more than a desperate play for attention and has been done countless times before.

It doesn't really matter if the character allows themselves to be recaptured or not, the goal here is having a horde of lemmings chasing after them in either case while their player holds full control over the story - it'd come as no surprise should they wish to drag that out.

[chris a gogo]

Dawn wrote.

If you think the slave caller not being in Guld is an issue, you probably also have an issue with slaves who have bluff/perform and can just hide themselves from the caller. Because with that, even being on the UD server you could never find them.

Slaves will and should try and find safety and/or freedom if they are being mistreated or play that they don't want to be enslaved.

Two things here.

One you are inferring an agenda into a mechanical exploit due to having more than one server.

Two if a players character is being mistreated and abused it's a reportable offense and nothing to do with RP, if they don't like the role play being given to them they simply ask the player to stop, and if they don't want to be enslaved there are ways to get free but by electing to play a slave they have agreed with the restrictions placed upon slave characters.

As you have stated there are means to avoid the caller already in place abusing an exploit should not be an option.

[Morgy]

Character gets collared, then runs off to "hiding" to a safe haven.

Sure, rumor that their masters have hired goons to drag them back might make the situation more immersive, but truth remains that they are extremely unlikely to succeed without the runaway's player active contribution to make that actually happen.

In the meantime the character earns extra attention points - which is why I believe many players act jaded toward escaped collared characters.
It's usually little more than a desperate play for attention and has been done countless times before.

It doesn't really matter if the character allows themselves to be recaptured or not, the goal here is having a horde of lemmings chasing after them in either case while their player holds full control over the story - it'd come as no surprise should they wish to drag that out.

+ 'You see, what you're describing here sure seems to me like enjoying a conflict situation while having 100% control with a finger hovering above the win button ready to push it on a whim the entire time.'

You've made an incorrect assumption about how I play this game, I'm afraid.

In addition, most stories have been done before. If the arc of escape and hiding, makes a player 'jaded', they have the choice to avoid it altogether. The fact is, a lot of players like helping on these arcs and it gives them some task to be involved in too. You've made some pretty disparaging remarks about what you think players are doing for 'desperate' attempts at attention. Everyone here likes to have some attention, otherwise we wouldn't be playing together on this small mmorpg type server.

Incidentally, not that many slave characters are hiding in Guldorand. They visit, sure, but a requirement of escape is to work tasks in the UD, and these characters often travels across the surface as well as returning below. They don't linger long, as they would never actually be free that way.

[Watchful Glare]

If you think the slave caller not being in Guld is an issue, you probably also have an issue with slaves who have bluff/perform and can just hide themselves from the caller. Because with that, even being on the UD server you could never find them.

This is not only a strange assumption to make about me, but also a wrong one. Much like there seemingly not being a transition to or from Guldorand in the Halls of Kelemvor, I think it's an oversight.

As a slaver, I have had slaves escape me all the time. I have also elected not to get involved at times if I thought my intervention wouldn't really contribute. As a slave, I hide when doing something I shouldn't be doing.

Slaves will and should try and find safety and/or freedom if they are being mistreated or play that they don't want to be enslaved.

I completely agree. But if that can still happen in the UD, the Surface, and Cordor & Planes server with a Slave Caller on them I do not see why there would be an issue with Guldorand having one as well.

[malcolm_mountainslayer]

Maybe because Guldorand isn't pro slavery to the point of having a slave master?