Vampiric Feast feedback

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Beary Nice
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2022 11:01 pm

Vampiric Feast feedback

Post by Beary Nice » Tue Jan 16, 2024 6:19 pm

Hi, I've been playing around with this Epic Spell for a while, and while I feel it's passable - barely - I think there's a lot of places it falls flat.

For those unaware, it's this:

Spellcraft Prerequisite: 32
Innate Level: 10
Component(s): Verbal
Range: Personal
Area of Effect / Target: Giant (15 meters radius)
Duration: 6 rounds
Save(s): None
Spell Resistance: No
Description: The caster issues forth a powerful curse. The area around the caster becomes rich with profane sigils and vile energy. Before long a calamity curse is unleashed with a single burst of power. Those affected become the subject of the curse spoken and branded as the prey for the caster's ungovernable, maddening hunger: the mark of the vampiric feast, the mark of the prey. Creatures with blood will suffer 3d6 bleeding damage twice per round for a period of 6 rounds. Each time they take damage it heals the caster for 1d4+2 damage (no overheal). Creatures without blood take entropy damage instead and do not contribute to healing. A creature can be subject to only 1 such curse at a given time. (It does not stack). The effect ends early if the caster dies. The caster without ESF Necromancy or Gift of Necromancy (LM) will take 40d4 damage after the spell is concluded.

I want to compare this to Hell Inferno. Why Hell Inferno? Because it's the same spell, but better.

Spell Level(s): Hemomancer 8, Warlock 6
Innate Level: 6
School: Evocation
Descriptor(s): Fire
Component(s): Verbal, Somatic
Range: Short (8 meters)
Area of Effect / Target: Single
Duration: 6 rounds
Additional Counter Spells: None
Save(s): Reflex (Special)
Spell Resistance: Yes

Description: The caster causes a target to ignite into flame, those who fail a reflex save vs. Fire suffer a -4 penalty to attack and damage rolls. Twice each round the target will suffer 2d6 points of variable (see Notes: default Fire) damage and 2d6 points of Magic damage.

Notes

Hell Inferno cast via the Hemomancer class spellbook now applies Bleeding Damage instead of variable.
Variable damage is increased by 1d6 per Spell Focus: Evocation feat for a total of 3d6 with Epic Spell Focus: Evocation.
A Warlock casting this spell will use the currently selected Eldrich Blast damage type for the variable damage component
Note: If the currently selected Eldrich Blast damage type is Magic, the damage is lowered by 1d6 (balanced to account for defensive essence)

Even disregarding the saveable part, that's 2d6 magic, and 2d6 variable (or Bleed when cast from the Hemomancer spellbook), with magic being one of the strongest damage types in the game, on a level 6/8 spell that can even be extended. And, that's not counting the fact that you can increase those by up to 3d6 extra damage, with Evocation spell foci. The only difference with Hell Inferno is that the application respects Spell Resistance, but that's easily overcome, even from a scroll. Meanwhile, Vampiric Feast is an epic spell, taking up a valuable epic feat, and not only that, it requires 32 spellcraft, which means that it's directly competing with Hellball (arguably much more useful).

This spell's primary design function seems to be area sustain for yourself in solo PvE, and nothing else; it is actively a detriment in every other scenario, and even then, while solo, it hurts your own summons to the point where if they're taking any damage from an outside source, it might be enough to finish them off on its own. Not only that, but assuming you're fighting a typical pack of 4-5 monsters, you could simply just drink two potions in a round and do infinitely more healing than the meagre 1d4+2 per target in a pinch. To boot, enemies have so much health by the time that you're doing those dungeons that you would be high enough level to even use the feat in the first place, that the 36d6 damage is almost inconsequential, especially if you have even one other person in your party.

In group PvE, you're doing that damage to your entire party. Team PvP? You're doing that damage to your entire party. It's a Giant radius, so it isn't really feasible to simply 'stay out of range'. It's actively hurting you.

So if not in those situations, what is it good for? The answer is, in its current state, very little. It's so low in the action economy queue that finding a good time to cast it and have it also be worthwhile is nigh impossible.

My main feedback is this:

3d6 * 12 as a DoT is far too low. It absolutely needs a flat buff to the damage dice, or (a worse solution, in my opinion) synergy with Necromancy to increase the damage dealt, whether more bleeding or a secondary damage type like Entropy (which it already is supposed to do to enemies without blood.) The damage dealt from Hellball is a straight 10d6*4, up front, with a knockdown tacked on. Greater Ruin is a straight 45d6 + 10. The fact that your enemies can simply heal through the damage from Vampiric Feast with a few chugs is beyond silly.


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ReverentBlade
Posts: 584
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:45 am

Re: Vampiric Feast feedback

Post by ReverentBlade » Wed Jan 17, 2024 1:38 am

I took this spell for the thematics and have used it maybe two or three times in the year and a half the character has existed. The friendly fire is the deal breaker, mainly, I can never justify the damage to summons or party.

I would love to see it reworked entirely, I feel like its premise and function is inherently flawed no matter how you tickle the numbers. It seems intended for either solo PvE or being ambushed alone on the road by a band of ninjas, and it isn't strong enough to save you in either of those niche disasters anyway so you're back to using your normal repertoire.

Personally? A battle transformation/aura similar to the new Elemental spell would be interesting.


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