New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

You have questions? We may have answers.

Moderators: Active DMs, Forum Moderators

Post Reply
Griefmaker
Posts: 812
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 8:33 pm
Location: California

New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Griefmaker » Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:07 pm

Hey everyone,

I had to get a new computer since my old mobo decided to hate life and smoke. The great news is that it is a really amazing machine in which any current game or graphics software will cry in frustration at not being able to make my computer weep whilst trying to process the load .

The bad news is that for some reason I am noticing a lot of momentary hiccups and delays IG. It seems to be random, but often I notice that it takes my inventory several seconds to show, or I type something and there is a several second delay before it is shown, things take a while to render (like NPCs suddenly appear next to my character as they are walking instead of seeing them when they come into view), or when trying to interact with something that it does not until after multiple tries.

Is this something others have experienced? Or does anyone have a suggestion on what steps might be taken to help it? I have done a minor amount of Google-fu, but figured I would toss the question on the forums here and do more research today after work.

Thank you!

User avatar
Sincra
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 219
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:48 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Sincra » Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:19 pm

I have always had micro-stutters from certain models loading in. I had thought that a common issue!
Specifically I was told some models were not properly compressed when added either in 1.69 or earlier pre-EE (See trenchcoat).

As for inventory, I am not sure what could cause that, perhaps again, a texture or model not being loaded fast enough?

The NPC issue I am also unsure on.

This may be an issue of one of two things in general, is my thoughts:
Latency (Net)
Loading models (Hardware latency)

There is an option you can turn on in settings (I forget where) that is meant to preload an area. I found that helped greatly myself.

Added note, the above is anecdotal at best and I wish you luck fixing it.
Irongron wrote:I've literally never used -guard on anyone.

Eyeliner
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed May 12, 2021 12:27 am

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Eyeliner » Sat Dec 04, 2021 7:19 am

NWN is such a janky game those bugs just sound like a normal day on Arelith to me. Though some areas do seem to take longer than ever to load lately (like outside Brog, ugh, I've had load times up to two minutes there) and other things have been suggesting it's a bit worse lately, so it may not just be your system. If things are really bad and the server has been up without reset for 24 hours it may not be you at all.

But I was going to say, did you do a fresh install of the game on the new system? If so you might go through and turn off every bell and whistle in preferences particularly graphics. Then gradually turn them back to see if they any of them might be causing havoc.

Aelryn Bloodmoon
Arelith Supporter
Arelith Supporter
Posts: 1927
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:57 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Aelryn Bloodmoon » Sat Dec 04, 2021 8:04 am

How new? Build specs and operating system?

If you're running one of the new 12th gen I-chips on windows 10/11, they're still working some kinks out on optimization for the task handling between the hybridized (P)rimary cores and (E)fficiency cores, and that's for newer software and tasks. I seem to recall at one point that NWN was locked to only running on a single core - as I'm typing this, I seem to remember there was even a line in the ini file you could alter to force the game to use a specific core at one point.

Not to say that any of it is related, but without any specs to go off of that's my first guess of what to look into. I haven't built my 12th gen system yet, but it has occurred to me when I do that if Beamdog doesn't update the game for hybrid processing I might have problems similar to what you're experiencing.
Bane's tyranny is known throughout the continent, and his is the image most seen as the face of evil.
-Faiths and Pantheons (c)2002

Void
Posts: 1601
Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:03 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Void » Sat Dec 04, 2021 8:14 am

Griefmaker wrote:
Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:07 pm
Hey everyone,

I had to get a new computer since my old mobo decided to hate life and smoke. The great news is that it is a really amazing machine in which any current game or graphics software will cry in frustration at not being able to make my computer weep whilst trying to process the load .

The bad news is that for some reason I am noticing a lot of momentary hiccups and delays IG. It seems to be random, but often I notice that it takes my inventory several seconds to show, or I type something and there is a several second delay before it is shown, things take a while to render (like NPCs suddenly appear next to my character as they are walking instead of seeing them when they come into view), or when trying to interact with something that it does not until after multiple tries.

Is this something others have experienced? Or does anyone have a suggestion on what steps might be taken to help it? I have done a minor amount of Google-fu, but figured I would toss the question on the forums here and do more research today after work.

Thank you!
If the game freezes for a short time, and doesn't react to any input, that's freeze that's local and happens on your end.

However, if you do something, see no result, but you can freely spin the camera, that's network lag or server freezing up.

One quick way to test for lag is to examine yourself with "eye" action. The command goes through server. If you do that and your description does not appear, you've lost connection. If it appears after split second, that's lag. If it appears after several seconds, the server was freezing up or heavily congested.

When the connection is lost for some reason, you can still move your character on the map, but the world does not react to you anymore, and portals, placeables and enemies you should've been able to see might not become visible. That lasts until the timeout.

So.

The game normally experiences small hiccups when something loads into the area. Those are local. For example, if you travle through an area and someone else enters and passes close, you might experience a hiccup even on an ssd.

However, if you examine yourself or open inventory and that takes a bit of time, that's not because it is loading, but because the server response takes time to arrive at your location.

Generally, I would not recommend doing anything dangeorus when population of any of the current server reaches 80-90 people. In this situation the game starts to lag heavily, and does not immediately react to commands. Meaning the combat might "Freeze" for you, and then the server will decide so in that time you were being bludgeoned to death by the enemies.
Another forum ban, here we go again.

User avatar
The GrumpyCat
Community Manager
Community Manager
Posts: 4886
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:47 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by The GrumpyCat » Sat Dec 04, 2021 11:28 pm

I've been getting this a lot of late to, of about the last month I'd say - though I've been experiencing it on other Online games too. Have you found it on other online games? I'm finding this thread very useful.
This too shall pass.

(I now have a DM Discord (I hope) It's DM GrumpyCat#7185 but please keep in mind I'm very busy IRL so I can't promise how quick I'll get back to you.)

Griefmaker
Posts: 812
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 8:33 pm
Location: California

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Griefmaker » Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:08 am

Hey everyone,

Thank you for the answers. I have been playing around with settings and the like and ensured the shiny water and other "extra" stuff was off. I was not noticing any changes though, which was odd.

For reference, the basic stats of my new rig are a Ryzen 9 5900, RTX 3080, 32 GB RAM, SSD (the new style, which is not SATA, but clips into a connector and is mounted on the Mobo). It also came with Windows 11...which I know could possibly be one of the issues too.

But then I decided just for grins to switch from my wired ethernet to the wifi card that I used to use which also has its own antennae and I noticed once I did that, my micro-lag seemed to disappear. Which seems completely illogical to me, but even when I was IG during today with 70+ people on the server, I was not noticing any of the micro-lag spikes.

So not sure what the heck the deal is, tbh. I'll keep testing to see if I notice anything else.

dallion43
Arelith Platinum Supporter
Arelith Platinum Supporter
Posts: 244
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:40 am

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by dallion43 » Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:49 am

If you used to use wired network on the old computer as well: check the router, you might have had a static IP on the old machine with specific ports open for it on the router.
Make sure wired connection connects directly to the router and that there no 100mb switches on the way, and that the network cable doesn't exceed 50ft.
If in your old machine you used Wi-Fi with this card: Try to update the driver for the internal network card from the new computer, and try an external network card if you have one.
Check the network adapter settings both for the wired and the Wi-Fi. Usually Wi-Fi has less advanced options turned on/existing. Try to disable things like the offset from the internal adapter for testing.

But first and foremost, if it does work on Wi-Fi card somewhat properly; Note any changes you do and make sure they are reversible to previous state. Also, test changes one by one and preferably return the change to previous state if it didn't help.

Griefmaker
Posts: 812
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 8:33 pm
Location: California

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Griefmaker » Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:15 am

Just as an update...

I was not having lag issues for a couple of days, but then started to notice it again today in Cordor. The servers had only been up for about 5ish hours and the population was not too bad (approx 30-40 players).

However, I did not experience any noticeable lag spikes on Surface, Distant Shores, and Guldorand. At least at the time. Recently (within the past 2-3 hours of posting this) with Surface having 65 players I did start to notice a little lag on occasion, but it was not the continual hiccups I experienced in Cordor and that is what we usually expect when the server population starts to get higher.

I know anecdotal evidence is sketchy at best, but for me at least, it seems something about Cordor is where I am having issues. Of even less empirical use is that whilst I was having the lag spikes in Cordor, I do not recall any whilst in the Plane of Shadows, despite it being on the Cordor server. However, just because I do not recall them does not mean they were not there. I may have just been numbed to it by that time :)

Not sure if any of this is useful to anyone, but I figure data points don't cost anything except for time from the writer and the sanity of the reader. Thanks all!

Edit: Nevermind, it is happening in the UD with 25 people on too. It might just be me sadly!

Aelryn Bloodmoon
Arelith Supporter
Arelith Supporter
Posts: 1927
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:57 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Aelryn Bloodmoon » Wed Dec 08, 2021 5:40 am

Griefmaker wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:08 am
Hey everyone,

Thank you for the answers. I have been playing around with settings and the like and ensured the shiny water and other "extra" stuff was off. I was not noticing any changes though, which was odd.

For reference, the basic stats of my new rig are a Ryzen 9 5900, RTX 3080, 32 GB RAM, SSD (the new style, which is not SATA, but clips into a connector and is mounted on the Mobo). It also came with Windows 11...which I know could possibly be one of the issues too.

But then I decided just for grins to switch from my wired ethernet to the wifi card that I used to use which also has its own antennae and I noticed once I did that, my micro-lag seemed to disappear. Which seems completely illogical to me, but even when I was IG during today with 70+ people on the server, I was not noticing any of the micro-lag spikes.

So not sure what the heck the deal is, tbh. I'll keep testing to see if I notice anything else.
One of the specs you didn't mention was your motherboard, or what type of wifi-card... if it's as spiffy shiny and new as the 3080 and the R9 you're running, it might have Wi-Fi 6E. If that's what you switched to, and you were using an extended length or older ethernet cable (most of them are unshielded against signal noise), it's not completely out of the realm of possibility that your connection speed and stability increased, although it would be a niche situation that would also depend on how many other users were on your network.
Bane's tyranny is known throughout the continent, and his is the image most seen as the face of evil.
-Faiths and Pantheons (c)2002

User avatar
The GrumpyCat
Community Manager
Community Manager
Posts: 4886
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:47 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by The GrumpyCat » Wed Dec 08, 2021 1:34 pm

Are you getting issues with other online games?
This too shall pass.

(I now have a DM Discord (I hope) It's DM GrumpyCat#7185 but please keep in mind I'm very busy IRL so I can't promise how quick I'll get back to you.)

Griefmaker
Posts: 812
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2014 8:33 pm
Location: California

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Griefmaker » Wed Dec 08, 2021 5:59 pm

Aelryn Bloodmoon wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 5:40 am
Griefmaker wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:08 am
Hey everyone,

Thank you for the answers. I have been playing around with settings and the like and ensured the shiny water and other "extra" stuff was off. I was not noticing any changes though, which was odd.

For reference, the basic stats of my new rig are a Ryzen 9 5900, RTX 3080, 32 GB RAM, SSD (the new style, which is not SATA, but clips into a connector and is mounted on the Mobo). It also came with Windows 11...which I know could possibly be one of the issues too.

But then I decided just for grins to switch from my wired ethernet to the wifi card that I used to use which also has its own antennae and I noticed once I did that, my micro-lag seemed to disappear. Which seems completely illogical to me, but even when I was IG during today with 70+ people on the server, I was not noticing any of the micro-lag spikes.

So not sure what the heck the deal is, tbh. I'll keep testing to see if I notice anything else.
One of the specs you didn't mention was your motherboard, or what type of wifi-card... if it's as spiffy shiny and new as the 3080 and the R9 you're running, it might have Wi-Fi 6E. If that's what you switched to, and you were using an extended length or older ethernet cable (most of them are unshielded against signal noise), it's not completely out of the realm of possibility that your connection speed and stability increased, although it would be a niche situation that would also depend on how many other users were on your network.
I appreciate all the help and suggestions!

As to the mobo, it is an ASUS Prime x570-Pro (link https://www.asus.com/Motherboards-Compo ... -X570-PRO/).

The wifi is Realtek 8821CE Wireless LAN 802.11ac PCI-E NIC (below is some of the info related to it, which I admit I used to know more about 20 years ago, but have not kept up with any of this):

Protocol: Wi-Fi 5 (802.11ac)
Security type: WPA2-Personal
Manufacturer: Realtek Semiconductor Corp.
Description: Realtek 8821CE Wireless LAN 802.11ac PCI-E NIC
Driver version: 2024.0.8.108
Network band: 5 GHz
Network channel: 157
Link speed (Receive/Transmit): 195/195 (Mbps)

I have found I am experiencing the same issues on both wired to the mobo's ethernet and wifi through the PCI-E NIC (which does have an external antenna). Sometimes it seems pretty regular. Like last night in the UD, I was noticing the lag which caused rubberbanding, failure to activate NPCs or levers or the like, etc. and it was happening pretty regularly...like around 4-5 times per minute. Each instance lasted typically about 3-5 seconds.

Grumpycat, as far as other online games...I have to admit, I do not have any others installed! But I have New World which I can reinstall later and try that a bit to see if I notice an issue with the lag in it too.

Thank you again everyone!

User avatar
MissEvelyn
Arelith Silver Supporter
Arelith Silver Supporter
Posts: 1157
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2015 8:43 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by MissEvelyn » Wed Dec 08, 2021 10:28 pm

One thing I had to do was go into the Nvidia control panel (usually by right clicking on your desktop and finding it through there), and then go to Manage 3D settings. Under the tab Program Settings, find NWN (or add it yourself make sure it's the nwmain.exe file you're targeting), and make sure Power management mode is set to Performance. When I did that with my laptop, everything in game ran so much smoother.

There's other options you can tweak there, like turning off V-sync, and so on =)

dallion43
Arelith Platinum Supporter
Arelith Platinum Supporter
Posts: 244
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:40 am

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by dallion43 » Thu Dec 09, 2021 2:07 am

A few simple tests to try to diagnose the issue:
*Open task manager(in windows 10, CPU/GPU current output, sort by CPU)
*Open 2 CMD.exe(command line).
In one type and click enter:
ping google.com -t
In second one type(This is Arelith server IP) and click enter:
ping 145.239.204.29 -t
make sure it starts pinging and you see the output properly.

Play the game. Alt tab during the spike and check the output of the 3 opened windows.
Check the task manager first. CPU/GPU additional spike due to alt-tabbing usually disappears almost instantly(~2-5 sec). Note if your CPU/GPU are still acting up after 2-5 secs. Check what is taking the CPU/GPU. Possible offender(example): windows defender.
Left click on the first CMD.exe window and click ctrl+c(keyboard). Repeat for the second one.
Scroll up to see the pings during the spike time. Check for lines with high "time=" or "Request timed out' lines.
You can add:
> C:\temp\PingTo-Name.txt
to the ping command to get a text file. (You might need to open CMD as admin, use different files names(PingTo-Name1/2)).

You can add a timestamp via powershell or basic script to the text output but if you alt-tab relatively fast after the spikes start it shouldn't be an issue.
Or, start the CMDs ping almost simultaneously and open the text files output in Notepad++ to compare line #s.

The output of the 3 during the spike will help you find out if it is hardware related, hub path(tracert) related or your network/isp related.

Another helpful test you can run after the above is:
open a CMD and paste: tracert 145.239.204.29
During the spike, alt tab to the opened CMD and run(left click on relevant CMD and click enter). Run the same during normal play(when it doesn't lag) and compare.

Aelryn Bloodmoon
Arelith Supporter
Arelith Supporter
Posts: 1927
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:57 pm

Re: New computer and noticing a lot of delays/small lag

Post by Aelryn Bloodmoon » Thu Dec 09, 2021 3:28 am

Griefmaker wrote:
Wed Dec 08, 2021 5:59 pm
I appreciate all the help and suggestions!

As to the mobo, it is an ASUS Prime x570-Pro (link https://www.asus.com/Motherboards-Compo ... -X570-PRO/).

The wifi is Realtek 8821CE Wireless LAN 802.11ac PCI-E NIC (below is some of the info related to it, which I admit I used to know more about 20 years ago, but have not kept up with any of this):

Protocol: Wi-Fi 5 (802.11ac)
Security type: WPA2-Personal
Manufacturer: Realtek Semiconductor Corp.
Description: Realtek 8821CE Wireless LAN 802.11ac PCI-E NIC
Driver version: 2024.0.8.108
Network band: 5 GHz
Network channel: 157
Link speed (Receive/Transmit): 195/195 (Mbps)

I have found I am experiencing the same issues on both wired to the mobo's ethernet and wifi through the PCI-E NIC (which does have an external antenna). Sometimes it seems pretty regular. Like last night in the UD, I was noticing the lag which caused rubberbanding, failure to activate NPCs or levers or the like, etc. and it was happening pretty regularly...like around 4-5 times per minute. Each instance lasted typically about 3-5 seconds.

Grumpycat, as far as other online games...I have to admit, I do not have any others installed! But I have New World which I can reinstall later and try that a bit to see if I notice an issue with the lag in it too.

Thank you again everyone!
Alright, so your board doesn't have its own Wifi, and your Wifi card is an AC model, which is Wifi 5 with less than a gigabit in capacity... based on your posted link speed (which it looks like you have room to improve if you move your computer closer to the router) your ethernet cable should be outperforming it by a factor of about five times so long as your ISP plan actually includes speeds high enough to take advantage of it.

Wifi 6, if you wanted to try an upgraded card down the line, would be a model with the letters ax after the numbers, and it's capable on a single stream of outperforming cat 5 ethernet cable by 20% (at 1.2 Gbps). If you want this upgrade, you're also going to have to upgrade your router to a Wifi 6 model.

How long is your ethernet cable, and is it running near any other wires? The ethernet controller on your board is a little dated and NWN is its own strange beast, but it's still a Gigabit connection and in terms of raw data throughput, there is zero reason your particular wifi card should ever outperform your ethernet cable in terms of latency, packet loss, or speed. Check to see if the cable is damaged or being interfered with by cable management that could be tidied up- you don't want your ethernet cable surrounded by/tangled up in other wires, ever (every ethernet cable I've ever seen in my life is unshielded, and this produces signal noise). Give it a clear path from port to port, even if this means you have to tie all your other connections together and out of the way.

There are several speed-test options available on the internet - pick your favorite reputable one and run it on the wifi vs. the ethernet. If the wifi is outperforming your ethernet connection in a raw speedtest, consider replacing your ethernet cable, especially if it's been bent into any various angles over the course of its life. You want the shortest ethernet cable you can get away with without pulling on the connection to your workstation or the router/modem- 10 feet or less at most for stable gaming connections, and five feet if you can pull it off without rearranging your entire station setup.

Edit: And if the ethernet outperforms your wifi as it should, your problem isn't based on your connection type, but possibly some router/firewall settings or perhaps internet routing strategy from you to the host and back - in this case, the server for Arelith. In the case of routing strategy, a VPN with a connection closer to the server than your station location MIGHT fix it, but depending on how populated your VPN service is, no guarantees. Could also just be NWN, being NWN. :( Sometimes old games be like that.
Bane's tyranny is known throughout the continent, and his is the image most seen as the face of evil.
-Faiths and Pantheons (c)2002

Post Reply