Epic Sacrifice

[xanrael]

Sadly the whole reward system is too easy to game, it's simply too easy to get to 26 and roll again and again.

Maybe it's just me, but I've yet to get a character to epic levels without coming to love the character and getting attached, making it harder for me to roll her.

Not only that, I've only ever gotten 2 characters that high in my +10 years here.

Well, you're not trying to game the system either. If the purpose of making a character was to get to level 26 ASAP you'd have different priorities on what you'd spend your time on.

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

[Sea Shanties]

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

I like that idea. I get that epic sacrifices encourage people not to play the same character for years, but rushing through throwaway characters isn't healthy for the server either and may even be worse. I can't imagine they RP much or do anything but complete writs and grind, which is generally someone less fun to have around than a long-term epic who's still socially involved.

[xanrael]

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

I like that idea. I get that epic sacrifices encourage people not to play the same character for years, but rushing through throwaway characters isn't healthy for the server either and may even be worse. I can't imagine they RP much or do anything but complete writs and grind, which is generally someone less fun to have around than a long-term epic who's still socially involved.

My thought process was it might encourage characters that are entrenched to roll once their "story is told". I know if I had some character I'd played for thousands of hours, 10% chance for a Major and 25% for a Greater isn't going to influence me to roll even if I didn't have anything interesting to do with them anymore. If I was so inclined I'd rather just take a week off that character to power grind to 26 on a character built for it. Which doesn't promote RP, but in my mind is what the current system encourages.

Back to the proposed idea, I think you'd want a soft and hard cap at some point too. Pulling these numbers out of thin air, but maybe after 1000 hours you'd get very little return on waiting, and after 2000 it would hard cap.

I think if you started the timer "today" and didn't make it retroactive that would also prevent a lot of people emptying out their vaults for Major/Greater rewards for a snowflake-pocalpyse 5 minutes after the update too.

[Biolab00]

Sadly the whole reward system is too easy to game, it's simply too easy to get to 26 and roll again and again.

Maybe it's just me, but I've yet to get a character to epic levels without coming to love the character and getting attached, making it harder for me to roll her.

Not only that, I've only ever gotten 2 characters that high in my +10 years here.

Well, you're not trying to game the system either. If the purpose of making a character was to get to level 26 ASAP you'd have different priorities on what you'd spend your time on.

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

No matter how i see it, it's probably impossible to hit level 26 in 50hours.
I supposed even 200hours is a problem unless you're a literal robot...

[Sartain]

Maybe it's just me, but I've yet to get a character to epic levels without coming to love the character and getting attached, making it harder for me to roll her.

Not only that, I've only ever gotten 2 characters that high in my +10 years here.

Well, you're not trying to game the system either. If the purpose of making a character was to get to level 26 ASAP you'd have different priorities on what you'd spend your time on.

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

No matter how i see it, it's probably impossible to hit level 26 in 50hours.
I supposed even 200hours is a problem unless you're a literal robot...

I doubt it'd be too difficult if you run with a group, build a decent party composition and know where the best grind spots are. So basically, the more entrenched in the server you are as player the easier it is to run a grind-party to get those rewards

[Biolab00]

Well, you're not trying to game the system either. If the purpose of making a character was to get to level 26 ASAP you'd have different priorities on what you'd spend your time on.

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

No matter how i see it, it's probably impossible to hit level 26 in 50hours.
I supposed even 200hours is a problem unless you're a literal robot...

I doubt it'd be too difficult if you run with a group, build a decent party composition and know where the best grind spots are. So basically, the more entrenched in the server you are as player the easier it is to run a grind-party to get those rewards

It's nightmare, my friend... nightmare~~~

[Ebonstar]

Sadly the whole reward system is too easy to game, it's simply too easy to get to 26 and roll again and again.

Maybe it's just me, but I've yet to get a character to epic levels without coming to love the character and getting attached, making it harder for me to roll her.

Not only that, I've only ever gotten 2 characters that high in my +10 years here.

have had 4 total reach 26, two 28 and one im playing currently who just hit 29 but his story is coming to a close due to many others retiring after year plus of play closing many storylines while he finishes up his others

[the grim yeeter]

Honestly I feel there should be a "time played" portion on the Epic Sacrifice roll by tracking total ticks. Rolling a character that has 2000 hours played should be a much bigger sacrifice than rolling a character that rushed to 26 in 50 hours.

I like this idea. As you said later, indeed, it should have a cap as well, so that people don't play their characters for literal years (I think long-existing characters should definitely be discouraged). Most of the characters that are out there that have existed for years hardly add anything to the server anymore.

No matter how i see it, it's probably impossible to hit level 26 in 50hours.
I supposed even 200hours is a problem unless you're a literal robot...

Trust me, this is not impossible at all. With the right build, knowing where the grind loops are, one or two friends with the same idea, and not being bad at the game, you can do this easily (and yes, people do this). People even did this before writs were a thing, but writs made it a lot easier.

[Twily]

I can understand wanting to keep the specifics to the roll vague, but I'm actually in agreement with Tarkus on feeling a bit lied to.

I was willing to give the devs benefit of the doubt here, or figured maybe the wiki was incorrect, so I went and found the Update Thread's release notes on this change.

It specifically states:

REWARD ROLLS

When rolling your character using the -delete_character function, the total value of their inventory, including equipment is factored into their reward roll. This is currently a +1 bonus for every 200 thousand gold, capped at 1 million.

And nowhere else in the update thread does it state this was changed.

If this formula isn't the one that's used, then I'd ask at the very least that it's made clear that it's actually 'a percentage value of their inventory', rather than 'total value of their inventory' as the update thread states. If the update thread hadn't specifically said 'total', or in some other way stated that 1gp isn't always counted as 1gp, I'd have no issues with it at all, even if I didn't know what counted for how much.

My only issue here is that the update thread specifically says 'total value', when it's apparently not.

[Seekeepeek]

i kinda reported to the admins in a PM, back when it was changed to:
"When rolling your character using the -delete_character function, the total value of their inventory, including equipment is factored into their reward roll. This is currently a +1 bonus for every 200 thousand gold, capped at 1 million."

That some items had unnatural high value. wasn't rare to find an item in a chest worth 100k to 200k. if you had 5 of those you was set. beside that you could craft "Concentrated Spider Venom" 5 poisons per craft worth 25k each. that's 100k worth of inventory value on a recipe that require 40 crafting points.

i rolled a bunch of characters that had inventory value as their main point of wealth... cause they was rather broken build wise. i had kinda hoped they did post it in the updates, else wouldn't had rolled my characters at that point.

so yeah.. i feel a tad lied to, even if i reported a related issue my self back then. -.-'

[Xerah]

Which update thread are you guys talking about?

[Seekeepeek]

viewtopic.php?f=23&p=187180#p187180

properly this one?

[Xerah]

There is nothing about any kind of update to the sacrifice there...

[Seekeepeek]

from a quick scan:
by Irongron » 08 Mar 2017 04:27

REWARD ROLLS
When rolling your character using the -delete_character function, the total value of their inventory, including equipment is factored into their reward roll. This is currently a +1 bonus for every 200 thousand gold, capped at 1 million.

Beside that. yes it's as you say... "There is nothing about any kind of update to the sacrifice there..."

i can't quote stuff in that topic cause of user restrictions, so you will have to find it your self. but searching for 1 milion in the topic make it pop up.

[Babylon System is the Vampire]

Guys, while I agree that the wiki could be written better saying "you feel lied to" is a bit much. The difference between 600 thousand and a mil is two percentage points...

[Dreams]

2% still makes a big difference when you consider the thing everyone hopes for is only a 5% to begin with.

Obviously players want to maximize the chance of getting something nice at the end of a story. It might just be a pat on the back, but the system is what restricts players from having access to particular playable races or classes. This means that this system is very important to some players who want to play one of these races or classes.

Saying 'I feel lied to' isn't a bit much. It is entirely accurate, if also emotional. I felt like I had been deceived when I found out that whilst the update/wiki both say 'total value of their inventory, including equipment', it isn't the case. I expect that when a developer or DM makes an announcement about something, they're trying to give players accurate information about what is happening. It frustrates me because it makes me think that a lot of extra time spent gathering things was wasted.

It makes me think 'Hey, that Normal reward I got when I rolled Ven might have been something else if his inventory was taken into account'.

[Tarkus the dog]

Guys, while I agree that the wiki could be written better saying "you feel lied to" is a bit much. The difference between 600 thousand and a mil is two percentage points...

It's still quite a bit. 400.000 gp isn't a small amount at all, and the 2% is 40% of the 5%. When you look at it that way, it's quite the difference. Not that I'm that much bothered, I mean. I may have sounded a bit too overzealous with my post. My 5% is just sitting in my vault and I'm not sure what to do with it. I just prefer a genuine approach when dealing with something like this. I rolled a few of characters in hopes of getting the greater reward to use it on a tiefling ( back when they weren't locked under the 5%), one legacy orog and one character I actually liked quite a bit. I got a 5% out of it, ironically enough, and never ended up making the tiefling.

Which is fine because I got a tiefling girlfriend instead, available now at www.paladinslooking4tieflinggfs.com. Order two and get the third for free, usual price of 399 ( only horns + tails combo available, naturally ).

Anyway, where was I? Oh, yeah. Would just appreciate some clarity when it comes to people rolling their dear characters in hope that they'd get an reward. I think it's fair. Because at the end of the day, people who 'power game' or whatever will figure out ins and outs of the system eventually, and everyone else will be hit by the vague info instead.

[CptJonas]

I will simply say this...if you want to sacrifice your high level character who you love....you should do your homework and research this topic...Dont cry here....

BTW....items over 50k value count just as 50k....as far as I know...so best thing to do is have lot of money in bank...and full inventory of items with value around 20k which doesnt take more then 2-3 inventory slots...Rings are best

[Drak]

I wish their was a better way to play a race that one might want to play rather than gambling with toons. But thats just me.

[TimeAdept]

I will simply say this...if you want to sacrifice your high level character who you love....you should do your homework and research this topic...Dont cry here....

BTW....items over 50k value count just as 50k....as far as I know...so best thing to do is have lot of money in bank...and full inventory of items with value around 20k which doesnt take more then 2-3 inventory slots...Rings are best

Source? Proof?

[Nitro]

I will simply say this...if you want to sacrifice your high level character who you love....you should do your homework and research this topic...Dont cry here....

BTW....items over 50k value count just as 50k....as far as I know...so best thing to do is have lot of money in bank...and full inventory of items with value around 20k which doesnt take more then 2-3 inventory slots...Rings are best

Holy condescending batman. How do you propose people should do research on this when the information given to players was both incomplete and wrong?

[Sartain]

I will simply say this...if you want to sacrifice your high level character who you love....you should do your homework and research this topic...Dont cry here....

BTW....items over 50k value count just as 50k....as far as I know...so best thing to do is have lot of money in bank...and full inventory of items with value around 20k which doesnt take more then 2-3 inventory slots...Rings are best

Holy condescending batman. How do you propose people should do research on this when the information given to players was both incomplete and wrong?

Yeah I don't see how you're supposed to research something that is intentionally undocumented and does not give you any detailed feedback on effect

[the grim yeeter]

I will simply say this...if you want to sacrifice your high level character who you love....you should do your homework and research this topic...Dont cry here....

BTW....items over 50k value count just as 50k....as far as I know...so best thing to do is have lot of money in bank...and full inventory of items with value around 20k which doesnt take more then 2-3 inventory slots...Rings are best

Holy condescending batman. How do you propose people should do research on this when the information given to players was both incomplete and wrong?

Yeah I don't see how you're supposed to research something that is intentionally undocumented and does not give you any detailed feedback on effect

He looked at the wiki page. But that information has only been added there a few days ago. Before that, nobody knew this. So really, no research could have been done, indeed.

[CptJonas]

Holy condescending batman. How do you propose people should do research on this when the information given to players was both incomplete and wrong?

Yeah I don't see how you're supposed to research something that is intentionally undocumented and does not give you any detailed feedback on effect

He looked at the wiki page. But that information has only been added there a few days ago. Before that, nobody knew this. So really, no research could have been done, indeed.

Its finaly on the wiki? I am actualy realy happy one doesnt need to spend time searching this up gods knows where....(To tell a true you could moust likely ask people....one gets to know secret....tells that to friend...and you know how it is...There would be many people these days who must know this...There are people who are powerleveling alts just to roll them...all the time....there are build especialy done for this....dont tell me that those guys dont know that info for years....and dont tell me that if you asked on discord...someone would not PM you answer....)
Please...less FOIG more normal info...please...

[Memelord]

Ah, see, except we don't know what percentage value those items are worth - or if the "maximum item value cap" at 50k GP is before the percentage is calculated, or after. The "probably 1/3 or 1/2" on the wiki is an arbitrary number pulled out of the aether and never actually verified by anyone with eyes on the code. It could be that items only count for 10% of their value, so your Sword of Moderate Asskicking which is worth 170k GP actually only contributes 17k towards your necessary 1 million - or that your Sword of Infinite Buttstomping which is worth 2,000,000 GP is also only worth 10% of its value, which is then further truncated to 50k total.

We have no way of knowing ANY of this. That's people's point.