Question on Sorc magic vs Lock magic

[The Rambling Midget]

Instead of spell resistance how does spell immunity work? I am almost certain in such cases I have seen warlocks hit spell immune targets with their range touched attack even when the initial spell cast, say flare, was ineffective due to spell immunity.

Spell Immunity blocks any spell at or below the immunity level. For example, Ghostly Visage will block all spells of level 1 or 0. Since Eldritch Blast is a dual effect and the blast itself has no spell level, the Flare spell will be blocked, but the blast damage will go through.

[Hunter548]

The summons are due to be nerfed at Some Point, as I understand it.

[Morderon]

i'm pretty sure warlocks don't respect mantles or spell immunities (as opposed to save and effect immunities).

Experience may be different with AoE spells.

[Scurvy Cur]

I suppose some of you might think "meh summons", but..:

Anyone saying so is deeply, grievously wrong, and has clearly missed every single mechanical update since about August of last year. I believe the warlock tops out at a summon that is completely superior to the gate summon (and is only otherwise available to epic Blackguards, and the. Only once per day)

[Plonkers]

honestly the "new" locks are just annoying to hunt with, too powerful compared to the rest of the party (granted i like to make weak builds) but really they do wicket damage and blasts everything faster than most.

now i dont care really that they are OP, but maybe they should not be playable by every person, make it tokened, reason: you see locks everywhere, shouldnt they be at least semi rare.

[Morderon]

Overpowered? I mean, they might have boosted, unlimited spells with no cooldown, but on the other hand they have bard skills, increased hit die, and damage resistance.

Honestly, the warlock should be a pretty powerful class in my opinion. There should be more downsides, but it's hard to persecute them without enlightened individuals defending their rights despite their alliance with beings of evil incarnate or to creatures of nightmares. I have seen several warlocks playing the martyr card when someone does confront them to the point of PvP, and many others defend them. Maybe it's time for another big warlock shake-up event?

And yeah this, warlocks should be a powerful, simple class. But one with a drawback. They shouldn't want to reveal their a warlock to the public. At least that's the feeling I got in the past.

I also think part of the problem is the pact for warlocks. Technically all the deal consists of is them losing bard song. Now this is great as it allows the player the freedom to come up with the terms of the deal. But it also allows them to well not to. However, IMO, it's not very believable, IC, that all a fiendlock gave up to summon balors, which are pretty high up on the demon hierarchy, an unlimited amount of times is the warlock's singing voice.

Feylocks don't even get anything noticeably questionable. other than the glowing eyes, perhaps if the dominate person spell (if not all of them) put out some kind of emote over the creature's head about the "self"/personality of the individual being eradicated possibly for long after the spell has expired? Just something to say their magic is vile.

Also, perhaps they shouldn't start with magic damage, or even have it and positive energy damage. The balance between magical and non-magical damage was fine before when the non-magic types had extra boons.

[Song of Storms]

Even still. My warlock tends to avoid summoning unless a situation looks reasonably dire. Generally they just ward a meat shield and provide supporting bursts. The one time I decided to go soloing with my demon however... *mutters about torches and pitchforks* just because your an evil soul selling warlock doesn't mean you have to be horrible about it..At least not all the time. *Makes sure no one is looking and punts a puppy over to a drider*

[Rattus_norvegicus99]

honestly the "new" locks are just annoying to hunt with, too powerful compared to the rest of the party (granted i like to make weak builds) but really they do wicket damage and blasts everything faster than most.

now i dont care really that they are OP, but maybe they should not be playable by every person, make it tokened, reason: you see locks everywhere, shouldnt they be at least semi rare.

I feel similar, though I really do care if they are OP, and I try my hardest not to make weak builds.

[KarlaFatehart]

Spell resistance can block both the effect and damage. I'm presuming you're speaking about my warlock since we traveled recently together, and spell penetration feats were among some of my earliest picks to push passed SR.

I agree that warlocks are incredibly powerful in a wide variety of situations (and with the dungeons getting harder and harder you almost NEED a warlock in some form or another - LOOKING AT YOU all mobs with automatic acid sheathe).

One thing I have to say is don't make the summon 1/day or on a cooldown timer, mostly because some warlock players (myself included) can't get through a dungeon without crashing at least five or six times. This would utterly destroy summoning capability. However even something as totally simple as kicking down the +5 whip to a +4 whip would have a huge change on the damage output. I'd say that if any changes are to be made, start with this and see what happens.

I think what might be a better change is to simply make it a token, or RPR requirement. I've frequently come across warlock players that don't know what a Fey or Fiend even is, out of character, and that's not a very good premise for warlock RP in character.

This all being said, I don't think warlocks are the most overpowered, with many late-level weaponmaster often pulling in three to four hundred damage in a single round, but they certainly are up there in the damage department.

[Morderon]

Even still. My warlock tends to avoid summoning unless a situation looks reasonably dire. Generally they just ward a meat shield and provide supporting bursts. The one time I decided to go soloing with my demon however... *mutters about torches and pitchforks* just because your an evil soul selling warlock doesn't mean you have to be horrible about it..At least not all the time. *Makes sure no one is looking and punts a puppy over to a drider*

The goal was less so "a warlock has to reveal he's an evil puppy kicking warlock in a combat situation" and more so "somethings not right about this character.. ALARM BELLS ALARM RING RING"

When they were first introduced they were the only ones that had unlimited magical abilities; which in itself could be alarming, possibly unnatural, to some characters. And that's before they (characters) even knew they were a warlock or even what a warlock was. Now we have as many unlimited-casting paths as we have non-path casters and unless if the character has some amount lore/spellcraft they'd just likely think that Feylock is some kind of enchantment true flame.

[Rattus_norvegicus99]

I just want to say, my original concern was not with the powerful summons, but with the way the Locks can bypass spell immunity. Though it was explained as a touch attack ... it still seems rather OP to me.