Player complaint about my mushroom gnome

[Waldo52]

I just made a new underdark character. He's a deep gnome who believes his Myconoid familiar was once a man, and that all men were once mushrooms who became corrupted. His myconoid shares in this delusion.

I possessed the familiar and spoke to people. He said "I was once a maaaaaaan!" and "one of us?!" My gnome would add in "Yes, soon he'll be just like us!" The gnome would try to reach for people and was generally terrifying people (in a fun way) as his gnome master begged humans to join his cult.

The gnome and his familiar are clearly disturbed and misguided so my intent was not to change or retcon any lore. But I received a tell regarding my disrespecting the setting so I put the character on hold pending opinions of DMs and players.

My goal was to bring a deluded oddball into the underdark and give the character strange beliefs that were clearly false. I did not interpret this as disrespecting the setting because part of his character is that he's completely full of **** and doesn't understand the world around him properly. I was not trying to change the setting to accommodate my vision.

Was my concept in bad taste? Also the angry player added the fact that myconoids can't talk to his list of complaints. I thought they possessing a familiar and talking through it was always acceptable and setting friendly.

He's level 3 and I have plenty of more normal underdark characters waiting to level up, so I'd like some opinions and possibly an official ruling on weather this is a character that should be shelved. He's a lot of fun, but I'll level my drow fighter instead if I have to.

[Void]

I just made a new underdark character. He's a deep gnome who believes his Myconoid familiar was once a man, and that all men were once mushrooms who became corrupted. His myconoid shares in this delusion.

I possessed the familiar and spoke to people. He said "I was once a maaaaaaan!" and "one of us?!" My gnome would add in "Yes, soon he'll be just like us!" The gnome would try to reach for people and was generally terrifying people (in a fun way) as his gnome master begged humans to join his cult.

One problem I see outright is this part of myconid description in monster manual:

Rapport: Myconids do not speak, but
these spores enable them to establish
telepathic communication with each other

I do not see any arelith ruling on talking familiars. However, people usually do not talk through them. Basically you need a DM opinion.

[MissEvelyn]

Animals do not speak either, yet Forgotten Realms has plenty of instances where people were polymorphed (as part of a curse for example) into an animal and were able to speak just fine.

In this instance, I believe WYSIWYG applies. So if mechanically a mage is able to speak through their familiar, then that is perfectly acceptable.

We like to add flavor to our familiars and play them with a bit of free will, but at the end of the day, the familiar is beholden to the wizard's will entirely.

[Curve]

Turn on -notells and play your character. Seems fun, engaging and original. Haters gonna hate.

[Void]

Animals do not speak either, yet Forgotten Realms has plenty of instances where people were polymorphed (as part of a curse for example) into an animal and were able to speak just fine.

Actually, regarding speaking animals there is a page in rules.
http://wiki.nwnarelith.com/Rules#On_Talking_Animals

The norm is using animal language and emotes.

[MissEvelyn]

Animals do not speak either, yet Forgotten Realms has plenty of instances where people were polymorphed (as part of a curse for example) into an animal and were able to speak just fine.

Actually, regarding speaking animals there is a page in rules.
http://wiki.nwnarelith.com/Rules#On_Talking_Animals

The norm is using animal language and emotes.

I stand partially corrected! This is a good find, and it seems like you need* a major award to be one of those polymorphed/wildshaped animals who can also speak.

It does not, however, address a mage's familiar. And since there is no ruling on that, we can only assume that mages on Arelith are allowed to convey words through their familiar.


*"Need" was a strong word to use. I personally disagree with the laxness of that ruling (note that it's heavily discouraged and not outright ruled no), but I understand that the DMs don't want to be quick to shoot down character concepts.

[Eyeliner]

If you do anything a little weird and that's not explicitly approved in a rulebook that you don’t own and that’s been out of print since 1995 someone will give you a hard time. There should just be a login message here, "Welcome to Arelith. You're doing it wrong".

I wouldn't ask a DM about something this minor, just do it and if a genuine problem a DM will probably let you know. Most likely no one will say anything because this is pretty minor. You might annoy a few players but after you've been here a while you realize some people just want to control everyone else's RP and it's not worth your time trying to appease them. Of course if you want to stick to what’s whitelisted in lore that’s totally cool and plenty of players live to put that knowledge to use, but if you’re feeling this character and want to see where it goes don’t let one opinionated player stop you.

[Biolab00]

I just made a new underdark character. He's a deep gnome who believes his Myconoid familiar was once a man, and that all men were once mushrooms who became corrupted. His myconoid shares in this delusion.

I possessed the familiar and spoke to people. He said "I was once a maaaaaaan!" and "one of us?!" My gnome would add in "Yes, soon he'll be just like us!" The gnome would try to reach for people and was generally terrifying people (in a fun way) as his gnome master begged humans to join his cult.

The gnome and his familiar are clearly disturbed and misguided so my intent was not to change or retcon any lore. But I received a tell regarding my disrespecting the setting so I put the character on hold pending opinions of DMs and players.

My goal was to bring a deluded oddball into the underdark and give the character strange beliefs that were clearly false. I did not interpret this as disrespecting the setting because part of his character is that he's completely full of **** and doesn't understand the world around him properly. I was not trying to change the setting to accommodate my vision.

Was my concept in bad taste? Also the angry player added the fact that myconoids can't talk to his list of complaints. I thought they possessing a familiar and talking through it was always acceptable and setting friendly.

He's level 3 and I have plenty of more normal underdark characters waiting to level up, so I'd like some opinions and possibly an official ruling on weather this is a character that should be shelved. He's a lot of fun, but I'll level my drow fighter instead if I have to.

I'm partially worried about your character because you mentioned that it's in UD.
If you've made a Goblin instead of a Gnome, i think it's probably going to be alright. I can't really explain since it's just a gut feeling from my time as a UDer.
fyi, my worried isn't about breaking rules but the intervention of other players to your story is probably unavoidable.

[Void]

It does not, however, address a mage's familiar. And since there is no ruling on that, we can only assume that mages on Arelith are allowed to convey words through their familiar.


*"Need" was a strong word to use. I personally disagree with the laxness of that ruling (note that it's heavily discouraged and not outright ruled no), but I understand that the DMs don't want to be quick to shoot down character concepts.

I would contact DMs and request a ruling. This can be done by sending them a private message through forums.

Myconids do not speak and familiars do not communicate with anyone other than their master. Basically the master has some sort of empathetic link with them, but familiars do not talk unless their creature type allows it. What's more a "tiny myconid" will not really be a myconid, but it will be marked as Fey in its description and that will be visible to all. There's still uncertainty about descriptions of skin-switched familiars, for example, I've seen people violently react to "Attack Dog" having "Outsider" in its description on surface.

Personally I would not play something like a mage with a talking mouse unless I'm given a permission from dm team. I did play a mute sorcerer that had a talking mouse on another server but I requested a permission for it and was granted it.

One other thing. Realistically speaking from all familiar shapes available ones with ability to speak would be Pixie, Parrot, Raven, and Fairie dragon would be able to speak sylvan and draconic. It is possible that Eyeball would be able to talk too.

So, when in doubt, I'd recommend to request permission or ruling.

The concept is fine, the problem is Myconid talking. Some people could be very upset by it, that's because I've seen character put a lot of effort into a non-talking myconid associate, and a talking myconid would go against their play. People who would chose to accept the concept would likely assume that this is not a myconid, but something else, that is messing with a gnome.

But in the end I'd advise to contact DM team and ask. It is better to ask than boldly go assuming it is fine. That's because if it turns out not to be fine, you'd need to can a concept you've invested into.

[Spriggan Bride]

Your concept is fine. It's your duty as a gnome to be eccentric. If in doubt leave it open that it's an illusion or a wild magic corruption or whatever would work. This is a magic world and weird things happen. You having a freakish talking familiar doesn't mean all mushrooms are now able to talk.

Feel free to ignore angry tells from busybodies. Especially if they're hostile. Life is too short.

[Waldo52]

Thank you for all the valuable feedback, people.

Feel free to ignore angry tells from busybodies. Especially if they're hostile. Life is too short.

Yeah, the guy is a real piece of work.

The dude who sent the tell is an irritating player who hangs out in the hub, but I'll omit any further identifying details. He spoke with such confidence and authority that I assumed he knew what he was talking about and that I was the one being unreasonable. In retrospect I feel a bit gaslit.

I immediately responded to his concerns by trying to open a dialogue and telling him the character would be shelved pending community and DM feedback out of fears I was harming the setting. Imagine putting your character on the back burner based off the complaint of a single player who invoked no DM authority and didn't even send a follow up or thank you tell after your complete and utter capitulation. What a sad, loathsome little toad.

[Void]

Thank you for all the valuable feedback, people.

Feel free to ignore angry tells from busybodies. Especially if they're hostile. Life is too short.

Yeah, the guy is a real piece of work.

Erm, namecalling players, even anonymously, on the forums is not a good idea.

In your scenario, I advise to get greenlight from DM team, by contacting them through PMs. To do that make a private message and send to "Active DMs". If t hey say "allowed", you're good to go and need nothing else. DM word is the law, and if they say t his is allowed, then it is allowed. I've not seen a single DM respond in this thread.

Upon seeing a talking myconid most of my character would refuse to accept it as a myconid and would be sure that it is something else, fooling the gnome. As myconids do not speak, and your myconid would be marked as "Fey" on the description. Where the interaction would go past that point depends on the character. A character in malevolent mood could try to instill fear of the myconid into gnome in question.

Another option that wouldn't cause any comlaints would be a gnome who insists that his myconid speaks, but nobody else hears it. That would likely be an insane character, but it would raise no objections whatsoever.

The reason for objections is not your gnome thinking that myconids were people. The reason for objection is talking familiar.

[mjones3]

Locking this thread because it has devolved to name calling and and finger pointing.

[Irongron]

Possessing and speaking through a familiar is perfectly allowed.

Possessing.

It's your character speaking.

Now she could be talking to herself, pretending, even convinced, that she is said creature.

Players can only roleplay their character, one character at any one time. Everything else is for DMs.

So what you did was fine, so long as we both understand - it was your gnome, in reality, doing the speaking.

Oh, and anyone that, reading the above, just immediately knows that any familiar speaking must be possessed by its master because NwN hasn't yet achieved advanced AI, is metagaming (but they can suspect it).