Warlock Pact RP

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Warlock Pact RP

Post by fading » Tue Jun 28, 2022 12:34 pm

"Note: Good/accidental/forced Warlock RP is not supported. All Arelith Warlocks have taken their pact voluntarily. The circumstances of this choice remain at the player's discretion."

I was wondering if deception would fall under this umbrella? If either through misunderstanding on part of the warlock or trickery from the patron, they thought the being to be something very different than what it is. I mean, that's kind of the whole point of the Star Pact, no?

Without spoiling too much, just in case, I had an idea for a warlock deluded into believing they serve/are chosen by a benign being, while slowly being corrupted/driven mad by the patron's influence. Would that fall under "accidental" or does it sound acceptable?

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by The GrumpyCat » Tue Jun 28, 2022 12:54 pm

I think the thing about warlock pacts, is that the warlock should, on some level, WANT the power they have, in the knowledge, on some level, that the pact is wrong - or else showing the pact is wrong in some other manner in their roleplay.

In the case of the example above... I think that'd be ok, so long as it was also obvious to anyone else that the pact was bad, and that they themselves were sliding into evil/insanity.

Basically thing we do NOT want: 'I'm Angela HoneyDelight and I was tricked into a pact by a naughty fey but I'm stuck forever and ever and ever and ever into it now! but it's not my fault I didn't want that awful pact! And now I shall use it for spreading love and kindness and cuddles and anyone who moves against me is a meany for attacking someone who can't help what sitaution they're in and is only doing stuff to be sweet and nice to people!'


But 'I'm Angel Honey Delight and I follow this fey power who says that they're nice! Some people say fey are evil but I know they are good! And I can prove it! See? My patron lead me to that farmers family were always hungry and miserable, so I killed the children last night! Now there will be less mouths to feed and so the family will be happier! Isn't my patron wonderful!'
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by garrbear758 » Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:13 pm

fading wrote:
Tue Jun 28, 2022 12:34 pm
I was wondering if deception would fall under this umbrella? If either through misunderstanding on part of the warlock or trickery from the patron, they thought the being to be something very different than what it is. I mean, that's kind of the whole point of the Star Pact, no?

Without spoiling too much, just in case, I had an idea for a warlock deluded into believing they serve/are chosen by a benign being, while slowly being corrupted/driven mad by the patron's influence. Would that fall under "accidental" or does it sound acceptable?
I am not a dm, but I feel like that's kind of a key part of warlocks. Their lust for power gets them in way over their head. On the wiki there are examples of this, such as an abyssal warlock slowly being convinced to do slightly more and more evil things until they're just as bad as a demon.

Interesting warlocks have a lot more nuance than "mua ha ha lets kill your puppy" *twirls mustache* and while you cannot be forced into the pact, it doesn't have to be as straightforward as "I'm evil so I made pact with evil to be more evil!1"
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Amateur Hour » Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:45 pm

Keep in mind you can get creative with the terms of the pact so that someone might think that, even though the entity they're pacting with is malicious, the terms don't necessarily require them to do anything that bad on the surface. Like, imagine a pact with a night hag--you get her power, and all she asks in exchange is that you pay boarding school fees for a hapless orphan she feels sorry for (that's totally not actually her daughter, nopenope, definitely not going to let that warlock WIS 8 shine). What's the harm in supporting an orphan, after all?

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by fading » Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:43 pm

Thank you everyone for the insightful replies!

So, to go over some things:
- My idea is definitely not accidental in the sense of "whoops, I made a pact with the naughty fey, oh wells, cool powers!" They have, in fact, strong religious convictions tying them to the pact, and they do, ultimately, think the being is working towards greater good and "enlightenment" while it most certainly isn't.

- I was thinking more lust for insight than power. Sure, they can be interchangeable terms in some discussions, I suppose. But, power, in the eyes of my character would be a side effect of the insight granted by their "deity."

To go a bit more in depth on the whole idea, without revealing specifics. I imagined the warlock would think of themselves more as a favored soul than anything, someone who has been touched by the divine after an attempt at making contact with their deity. Something is clearly /wrong/ with the "deity" in question, but they believe, via narcissism, they're merely glimpsing the truth that laymen and clergy couldn't possibly comprehend. After that, is layer after layer of self-delusion - the urges, the nightmares, the horrific destructive powers they now hold - merely tests, or hidden truths, or whatever eases the mind at the time. They would hide as a follower of their faith, slowly slipping some of the horrific visions they've experiencing, subverting established dogma - maybe even attempting to create an established heretic branch of the clergy. I mean, probably not, lofty aspirations and all, just trying to explain the /vibe/ of the character and if it would fit with the server's expectations for warlocks.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Good Character » Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:02 am

Based on what you described, definitely take some inspiration from Arthas Menethil, the infamous Lich King. It's such an underutilized trope because of how poorly it's done sometimes; usually it turns into an excuse to do bad versus the character truly believes they are still doing the right thing like Arthas had.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by MRFTW » Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:45 am

As an example of a fey pact, I had a little gnome that planted seeds. He knew a lot about botany, and found it a noble goal to spread different varieties of plants around the world, increasing the ubiquity of healing herbs, food crops, etc.

In reality, he was planting covering scrub brush and trees for spies of the dark Queen to perch in. He would be planting trees in glades where saprotrophic fungi grew, dooming the saplings to wither, die and be consumed over years or decades, a process that he, as a long-lived gnome, would've been likewise doomed to watch. He planted a hardwood (I imagined oak but I don't know if FR has oak trees) which I fancied, after it had grown, would have been forseen by the Queen to be an important hiding place for one of her powerful agents.

My inspiration was the curse placed on Hurin by Morgoth, in Middle Earth, specifically "upon all whom you love... Wherever they go, evil shall arise. Whenever they speak, their words shall bring ill counsel. Whatsoever they do shall turn against them."

I always thought the curse of bad luck combined with having to see it unfold was evil on a deep, deep level, that really has no limits besides that of one's own imagination.

-

My star pact warlock/LM leant into the spot bonuses from the pact. A lot. They were smart and wise, but they had a thirst for knowledge and secrets that simply couldn't be sated. They got a truly whopping spot/listen score, and she didn't know the name of her patron. She thought of them as "The Watchers". That pact I envisaged as a conversation that went something like:

"There is an offer and a price."
"What is the offer?"
"Sight, beyond sight. Knowledge, beyond knowing."
"What is the price?"
"The same."

Mechanically, I took this as getting better detection skills, at the expense of having her entire human(ish) experience relayed to mysterious, malevolent forces from far away. Understanding the mortal experience may or may not have provided those distant powers with some soul-harvesting insight or something. For a mere Aasimar like my character, or a mere human such as myself to guess what such evil would do with that knowledge could only be speculative.

I like the idea of pacts that sound simple and alluring, but are much deeper and terrifying when you really think about them. My inspiration with the second was simply the phrase "Be careful what you wish for".

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by garrbear758 » Wed Jun 29, 2022 4:22 pm

MRFTW wrote:
Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:45 am
As an example of a fey pact, I had a little gnome that planted seeds. He knew a lot about botany, and found it a noble goal to spread different varieties of plants around the world, increasing the ubiquity of healing herbs, food crops, etc.

In reality, he was planting covering scrub brush and trees for spies of the dark Queen to perch in. He would be planting trees in glades where saprotrophic fungi grew, dooming the saplings to wither, die and be consumed over years or decades, a process that he, as a long-lived gnome, would've been likewise doomed to watch. He planted a hardwood (I imagined oak but I don't know if FR has oak trees) which I fancied, after it had grown, would have been forseen by the Queen to be an important hiding place for one of her powerful agents.

My inspiration was the curse placed on Hurin by Morgoth, in Middle Earth, specifically "upon all whom you love... Wherever they go, evil shall arise. Whenever they speak, their words shall bring ill counsel. Whatsoever they do shall turn against them."

I always thought the curse of bad luck combined with having to see it unfold was evil on a deep, deep level, that really has no limits besides that of one's own imagination.

-

My star pact warlock/LM leant into the spot bonuses from the pact. A lot. They were smart and wise, but they had a thirst for knowledge and secrets that simply couldn't be sated. They got a truly whopping spot/listen score, and she didn't know the name of her patron. She thought of them as "The Watchers". That pact I envisaged as a conversation that went something like:

"There is an offer and a price."
"What is the offer?"
"Sight, beyond sight. Knowledge, beyond knowing."
"What is the price?"
"The same."

Mechanically, I took this as getting better detection skills, at the expense of having her entire human(ish) experience relayed to mysterious, malevolent forces from far away. Understanding the mortal experience may or may not have provided those distant powers with some soul-harvesting insight or something. For a mere Aasimar like my character, or a mere human such as myself to guess what such evil would do with that knowledge could only be speculative.

I like the idea of pacts that sound simple and alluring, but are much deeper and terrifying when you really think about them. My inspiration with the second was simply the phrase "Be careful what you wish for".
These are really cool
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Xerah » Wed Jun 29, 2022 4:32 pm

While it doesn't have to be a forced pact, you could still consider that "this is your only option so you agree to take it" and end up in some clashing of motivations to sort through.

For example, my fey warlock was pacted to a redcap. Redcaps, while murdery, are also known to consume anything and everything. My character was the matron of a small house (where all the family members were fey pacted) but it meant this max CHA "pretty" drow would eat/consume so much more than anyone would think was realistic. There was more to it than that (i.e. I think compulsions are fun to play with, such as she could never turn down an offer of food, which could have been interesting with the food poison system)

While it would have made more sense for the drow matron to be pacted to something like the QoAaD, I thought the clashing of styles might make things a bit more interesting.
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Kuma » Thu Jun 30, 2022 4:13 am

MRFTW wrote:
Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:45 am
As an example of a fey pact, I had a little gnome that planted seeds. He knew a lot about botany, and found it a noble goal to spread different varieties of plants around the world, increasing the ubiquity of healing herbs, food crops, etc.

In reality, he was planting covering scrub brush and trees for spies of the dark Queen to perch in. He would be planting trees in glades where saprotrophic fungi grew, dooming the saplings to wither, die and be consumed over years or decades, a process that he, as a long-lived gnome, would've been likewise doomed to watch. He planted a hardwood (I imagined oak but I don't know if FR has oak trees) which I fancied, after it had grown, would have been forseen by the Queen to be an important hiding place for one of her powerful agents.

My inspiration was the curse placed on Hurin by Morgoth, in Middle Earth, specifically "upon all whom you love... Wherever they go, evil shall arise. Whenever they speak, their words shall bring ill counsel. Whatsoever they do shall turn against them."

I always thought the curse of bad luck combined with having to see it unfold was evil on a deep, deep level, that really has no limits besides that of one's own imagination.

-

My star pact warlock/LM leant into the spot bonuses from the pact. A lot. They were smart and wise, but they had a thirst for knowledge and secrets that simply couldn't be sated. They got a truly whopping spot/listen score, and she didn't know the name of her patron. She thought of them as "The Watchers". That pact I envisaged as a conversation that went something like:

"There is an offer and a price."
"What is the offer?"
"Sight, beyond sight. Knowledge, beyond knowing."
"What is the price?"
"The same."

Mechanically, I took this as getting better detection skills, at the expense of having her entire human(ish) experience relayed to mysterious, malevolent forces from far away. Understanding the mortal experience may or may not have provided those distant powers with some soul-harvesting insight or something. For a mere Aasimar like my character, or a mere human such as myself to guess what such evil would do with that knowledge could only be speculative.

I like the idea of pacts that sound simple and alluring, but are much deeper and terrifying when you really think about them. My inspiration with the second was simply the phrase "Be careful what you wish for".
these are sick as hell, i love them

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by msterswrdsmn » Thu Jun 30, 2022 6:40 am

Deception from the warlocks patron is 100% canon. Star pact warlocks for example, can be tricked per the wiki
In some cases, star pact warlocks were unaware of how strongly these stars were connected to the dark powers of the Far Realm and were guided to their pact through haunting nightmares. Such warlocks might have viewed the source of their powers as innocent or at the very least under their control. Others were fully aware of the connection and exploited it anyway, either due to insanity or sheer ambition. Still others viewed these pacts, if they were even aware of them, with an even higher degree of suspicion than normal warlocks warranted, since the aberrant powers of the Far Realm were more horrific than any devil or fey spirit.
I can absolutely see something like a malevolent power willfully misrepresenting themselves in a pact to lure their new hosts into a false sense of control or security. This is probably more likely with things like unseelie or star pacts, as you pretty much know what you're getting into when taking pacts like say, the undead pact.

As the hosts power grows, they become more and more dependant on their pact powers, eventually becoming entirely dependent on them. Kind of like a small indulgence growing into a rampant addiction. In fact, i'd say its -exactly- like that; most of our worst habits start off small before growing into an unquittable monster. Like smoking.

Even if you later become fully aware of how terrible your pact/smoking is, you're too far gone to easily give it up. Though with pacts, you're gaining real, tangible power, which is -very- difficult to give up once you've established it

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Wethrinea » Sun Jul 03, 2022 9:15 am

There is also the Ammon Jerro type of warlock, who while evil, is not so out of malice, but because he believes it is necessary for the "greater good".

Mechanically, most warlocks have low wisdom because that is a useless stat, like strength, in those builds. And I think that is quite apt, and should be utilized in RP when it comes to the warlocks own understanding of just how much control they are in of their powers.
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Lass is Class » Sun Jul 03, 2022 10:54 pm

msterswrdsmn wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 6:40 am
Deception from the warlocks patron is 100% canon. Star pact warlocks for example, can be tricked.

As the hosts power grows, they become more and more dependant on their pact powers, eventually becoming entirely dependent on them. Kind of like a small indulgence growing into a rampant addiction. In fact, i'd say its -exactly- like that; most of our worst habits start off small before growing into an unquittable monster. Like smoking.
That is a very accurate description of how Far Realms Pacts oftentime work. Was especially interesting seeing Preserver's viewtopic.php?f=19&t=37488 warlock who followed this type of theme narrowly and expertly.

I'd suggest contacting them for this type of experience.
--
As a side note - definitelly, future warlocks can be tricked into getting that 'special something' that they need or crave. And as far as such sources of Power go, they inevitably corrupt the warlock as result. How fast the corruption grows within their character, how much they are willing to resist the urges to tap into alien Power, is entirely up to the player's discretion - and can be tons of fun to explore all sides of character, both dark and potentially redeeming.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Irongron » Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:04 pm

garrbear758 wrote:
Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:13 pm

I am not a dm, but I feel like that's kind of a key part of warlocks. Their lust for power gets them in way over their head. On the wiki there are examples of this, such as an abyssal warlock slowly being convinced to do slightly more and more evil things until they're just as bad as a demon.
You likely recall that for a time I wanted Warlock PCs to get 'demands' levelled against them by their patron power, in keeping with the alignment and theme of the power, a bit like the Radiant Heart quest system, but decidedly NOT optional, and with the only reward being the ability to retain one's warlock abilities.

Too harsh? Possibly, but the much harder part would be the massive time investment in preparing and scripting enough of these 'payments' to keep the system interesting.

I do hope people RP similar stuff though.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Preserver » Mon Jul 04, 2022 12:03 pm

Hello!
In my personal experience (and current academical IC classes that are being held by my former Warlock PC), there is a single thing that must kept in mind when RPing a Warlock: the Warlock is aware they entered a Pact as you play them, and they did enter the Pact willingly.

Does that mean the character must be fully into murdering small mammals and rudely pushing old women? No.
However keep in mind that by entering a Pact, even with good intentions, a Warlock does something utterly wrong as far as the cosmology of the world goes. It is a "wrong" way to get magical power that goes against the suggested rules by the Gods and the magical systems. Imagine it as some sort of cheat, only deeply connoted on the moral point of view.

The Warlock can be tricked into it thinking the Pact less evil than it actually was, but they know it is a Pact with an unwholesome entity, and there is actually a lot of interesting RP to be performed if you want to go with the "I did it for the greater good." reasoning... not that it will probably convince many, but still :P !

Your Pact must be made willingly, but do not make it devoid of nuance!

ADDITION - especially going for the Star or Fathomless patrons, do try to be as -vague- as you can about their nature. I feel that such creatures must hold absolute mystique to avoid falling in Lovecraftian pastiche or just tentacly banality.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by chris a gogo » Mon Jul 04, 2022 3:01 pm

All hail great Cthulu.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Eyeliner » Mon Jul 04, 2022 10:03 pm

Preserver wrote:
Mon Jul 04, 2022 12:03 pm
ADDITION - especially going for the Star or Fathomless patrons, do try to be as -vague- as you can about their nature. I feel that such creatures must hold absolute mystique to avoid falling in Lovecraftian pastiche or just tentacly banality.[/b]
Is this a server rule or your opinion? Because almost everything on Arelith could be considered a tired fantasy trope or pastiche if you don't bring your own originality and imagination to it.

I can see just as solid RP coming from trying to make sense of a star or fathomless pact patron or coming up with details as to how theirs operates as keeping it vague, if the player is inspired and creative (and yes it may all be hot air and not how it actually works, that's fine too). Heck I'd almost always rather see that than someone being tight lipped because they're afraid they're not allowed to go there.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Kuma » Tue Jul 05, 2022 7:56 am

Eyeliner wrote:
Mon Jul 04, 2022 10:03 pm
Preserver wrote:
Mon Jul 04, 2022 12:03 pm
ADDITION - especially going for the Star or Fathomless patrons, do try to be as -vague- as you can about their nature. I feel that such creatures must hold absolute mystique to avoid falling in Lovecraftian pastiche or just tentacly banality.[/b]
Is this a server rule or your opinion? Because almost everything on Arelith could be considered a tired fantasy trope or pastiche if you don't bring your own originality and imagination to it.

I can see just as solid RP coming from trying to make sense of a star or fathomless pact patron or coming up with details as to how theirs operates as keeping it vague, if the player is inspired and creative (and yes it may all be hot air and not how it actually works, that's fine too). Heck I'd almost always rather see that than someone being tight lipped because they're afraid they're not allowed to go there.
It's half and half. There's a reason it's Star Pact and not Great Old One pact (which it was in development), and why the home-brew star and fathomless themed patrons veer away from lmao tentacles and lovecraft in favour of something a little more vague and open-ended.

Obviously players can lean further into that as you say but it was decided to make them a bit more vague to enable players to make that decision themselves.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Eyeliner » Tue Jul 05, 2022 8:10 am

I get it, and you shouldn’t use Lovecraft as-is because it’s not Forgotten Realms, but I am also not sure why a Cthulu influence is lmao if you want to use that as a starting point if that inspires you. Tentacles aren’t any more ridiculous than dragons, elves and dwarves, it’s all stuff that’s been done to death if you want to look at it that way.

I just don’t think the message should be “you have to keep it vague” as much as “the lore is vague, make of it what you will” with the caveat your personal lore will in all likelihood die when the character is deleted.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Preserver » Tue Jul 05, 2022 9:49 am

Yes I probably was a bit too prescriptive.

It is by all means my personal opinion and preference and should by no mean be the automatic go-to.

To rephrase in a better way: I think that the themes of Star Patrons (which are very often connected, in our knowledge of the real world, to the works of Lovecraft or other weird and eldritch precursors or inspired works) are more engagingly expressed by retaining their "incomprehensible" mystique. That is because much of their fascination, I believe, is based on the fact that they are partially (or completely) unknowable in their intentions, which makes them creepy, and by making them less unknowable some of their specific brand of creep factor would fade.

This is also based around the general idea that, as presented and ruled on Arelith, all Patrons are a measure of creepy because they are inherently malicious, and each brand of Patron is a specific brand of malice.
I personally always interpreted Star not necessarily as willingly malicious (because that would make them explainable and knowable), but simply so utterly different compared to standard morality and life that they end up embodying aspects that are incompatible with existance as it is.

BUT...
This needs not be a lecture on this stuff. Apologies for derailing the conversation with that comment.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Ithalan » Tue Jul 05, 2022 1:23 pm

I do think the Star pact lends itself very well to warlocks that aren't openly malicious, but merely in pursuit of strange or unknowable goals that are harmful to others only as a side-effect of their accomplishment (perhaps over time-scales so long that the consequences are not clear to those who don't care or wish to consider them), or that leave the warlock with a callous indifference to things they consider of lesser concern than these alien designs.

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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Hunter548 » Tue Jul 05, 2022 6:56 pm

Irongron wrote:
Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:04 pm
garrbear758 wrote:
Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:13 pm

I am not a dm, but I feel like that's kind of a key part of warlocks. Their lust for power gets them in way over their head. On the wiki there are examples of this, such as an abyssal warlock slowly being convinced to do slightly more and more evil things until they're just as bad as a demon.
You likely recall that for a time I wanted Warlock PCs to get 'demands' levelled against them by their patron power, in keeping with the alignment and theme of the power, a bit like the Radiant Heart quest system, but decidedly NOT optional, and with the only reward being the ability to retain one's warlock abilities.

Too harsh? Possibly, but the much harder part would be the massive time investment in preparing and scripting enough of these 'payments' to keep the system interesting.

I do hope people RP similar stuff though.
This is the kind of thing that's nice in theory and would be cool to do as a player initiative, but wouldn't translate well as a game system. You'd lose a lot of nuance (and probably a lot of ability to convincingly play a neutral warlock, or a warlock who starts neutral), and it'd be very hard to avoid pigeonholing the various pacts. Some of them (Abyssal or Undying, for example) could have patrons with wildly different desires depending on their exact nature.


Honestly, on some level I think it'd be healthier if Arelith backed off on treating warlocks like they're all psychotic cultists but I'm doubtful of how likely that is to happen. Having a little more nuance to it seems like it'd be better though - and both closer to PnP and more new-player-friendly.
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Kuma » Wed Jul 06, 2022 6:46 am

Irongron wrote:
Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:04 pm
You likely recall that for a time I wanted Warlock PCs to get 'demands' levelled against them by their patron power, in keeping with the alignment and theme of the power, a bit like the Radiant Heart quest system, but decidedly NOT optional, and with the only reward being the ability to retain one's warlock abilities.

Too harsh? Possibly, but the much harder part would be the massive time investment in preparing and scripting enough of these 'payments' to keep the system interesting.

I do hope people RP similar stuff though.
I'm echoing hunter here, I think a mechanical system would strip them of player initiative. However giving Warlocks familiars lets me do this myself! An Imp or similarly spooky-sentient familiar could well be utilised to deliver demands and insights, it just relies on the player's agency rather than some quasi-writ system where you have to chew babies or lose your class.

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msterswrdsmn
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by msterswrdsmn » Thu Jul 07, 2022 6:25 am

I wouldn't necessary consider star pact warlocks to be less malicious than other pacted, as a whole. Knowingly or not, they're getting their powers from the Far Planes, which typically is summerized as "evil aliens". Even baator or the abyss are more hospitable than the Far Planes inhabitants (not the stars themselves) ,which canonically make people go insane just by glimpsing at it. Actually traveling there will also mutate you.

The actual use of the powers doesn't have to be evil per se, but that goes for any pact, really. So long as the terms of whatever pact/contract the person made are being upheld, I can't really see anything stopping a warlock from using their powers for good. Unless their pact prohibits it, for some reason. Star pacted are really more or less special than other pacts, in this regard.

Having a character tricked into thinking they're something like a Favored Soul when in reality they're a warlock due to some shady patrons deception doesn't really change the actual nature of the pact; just the persons perception of it. Whether they're doing good or evil, they are, more likely than not, doing something that their patron wants them to do. Ex: A follower of Selune having visions of the stars granting them power to spread to word of the moonmaiden actually being a Far Realms entity attempting to establish cults that feed their power while falsely believing they're doing a new way of worship to Selune. Might be with good intentions and even execution, but you're still feeding an evil eldritch horror.)

The only truely "good" warlocks i've seen in DnD lore are things like Celestial pacts, which i'm pretty sure we aren't doing here.

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Hunter548
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Re: Warlock Pact RP

Post by Hunter548 » Thu Jul 07, 2022 6:24 pm

msterswrdsmn wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 6:25 am

The only truely "good" warlocks i've seen in DnD lore are things like Celestial pacts, which i'm pretty sure we aren't doing here.
PnP warlocks aren't quite like Arelith, and don't have any restriction on alignment outside of 3.x. In 3.x they just have to be chaotic if they're good aligned.

In PnP warlocks largely aren't quite as explicitly locked to being direct agents of their patron, and are (as far as I can find sources for) perfectly able to take their cool laser powers and start ruining their patron's other plans afterwards.

PnP warlocks also aren't necessarily the immediate makers of their pacts. Complete Arcane says warlock powers can sometimes be inherited like sorcerer bloodlines, and my understanding is 4e/5e allow the same sort of thing.

Now, Arelith's moved away from that for pretty good reason given what happened when Warlocks were first added, but I personally think too far the other direction. I watched a level 6-8 warlock get lynched in Cordor the other week for the crime of being seen using eldritch blast in the Bramble Woods. That sort of thing gives me a bad taste in my mouth for a base class that while worthy of suspicion and caution, doesn't turn you into Mega-Hitler in any other instance of d&d.
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