So, I've been noodling around this game every few weeks for the past couple of months. I think it started out when my internet connection was out for a few days. Anyway. . .
Has anyone played these games? If so, are the second and third better than the first? I think the reason why I play it so infrequently is because I am so overwhelmingly lost. It is literally worse than daggerfall on being lost.
Any other great dungeon crawlers for MS-DOS that any of you have played?
My personal favorite (aside from daggerfall) Is Ultima Underworld 2.
Anybody up for some 90s MS-DOS nostalgia?
D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
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D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Last edited by Manabi on Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Owlbears are the only thing keeping Arelith from the D&D experience.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
I am not really fond of the maze-like nature of Eye of the Beholder (similar to the Wizardry, Bard's Tale, Menzoberranzan and Might & Magic games). It is really easy to become lost.
Try a top-down, like Darksun: Shattered Lands (uses AD&D 2nd ed.), or one with a proper '3D' world (and smooth turning) like Betrayal at Krondor. That one is based on a book. The writing is excellent and the music is great. It is my favorite game on MS-DOS.
I am a sucker for isometric games, and highly recommend Faery Tale 2: Halls of the Dead. It's very basic. Darklands is also cool if you want a historical fantasy. Heimdall is an excellent dungeon crawler series of games with cute cartoon-like graphics. VIKINGS!
Other random picks... Wasteland (if you can stand the hideous 16 colour graphics) is a cool post-apocalyptic game, and considered the spiritual predecessor to Fallout. Starflight, if you like SPACE. I remember that one being kind of complicated, though...
If you would like a puzzle point-and-click adventure of decent quality that doesn't send you through endless 'countryside' rooms only to end in you being eaten by a grue, I HIGHLY recommend Death Gate (it puts the marmalade on the bread). Amazing writing in this, and choices have some logical bearing. Don't tie up the elven children with the rope. For a more light hearted point-and-click, try the Curse of Enchantia. There is no dialogue in this, and reminds me of a slower paced Dragon's Lair.
...Princess Maker 2 is an excellent dungeon crawler / RPG. Seriously. Laugh all you want. It's actually really, really great. Until your daughter becomes a dominatrix when she turns 18.
Recommendations brought to you by someone who had no internet until 2004 and was stuck playing abandonware around the clock.
Try a top-down, like Darksun: Shattered Lands (uses AD&D 2nd ed.), or one with a proper '3D' world (and smooth turning) like Betrayal at Krondor. That one is based on a book. The writing is excellent and the music is great. It is my favorite game on MS-DOS.
I am a sucker for isometric games, and highly recommend Faery Tale 2: Halls of the Dead. It's very basic. Darklands is also cool if you want a historical fantasy. Heimdall is an excellent dungeon crawler series of games with cute cartoon-like graphics. VIKINGS!
Other random picks... Wasteland (if you can stand the hideous 16 colour graphics) is a cool post-apocalyptic game, and considered the spiritual predecessor to Fallout. Starflight, if you like SPACE. I remember that one being kind of complicated, though...
If you would like a puzzle point-and-click adventure of decent quality that doesn't send you through endless 'countryside' rooms only to end in you being eaten by a grue, I HIGHLY recommend Death Gate (it puts the marmalade on the bread). Amazing writing in this, and choices have some logical bearing. Don't tie up the elven children with the rope. For a more light hearted point-and-click, try the Curse of Enchantia. There is no dialogue in this, and reminds me of a slower paced Dragon's Lair.
...Princess Maker 2 is an excellent dungeon crawler / RPG. Seriously. Laugh all you want. It's actually really, really great. Until your daughter becomes a dominatrix when she turns 18.
Recommendations brought to you by someone who had no internet until 2004 and was stuck playing abandonware around the clock.
When my brood and I soar on wings of fire, and wreak our scourge over Caer Callidyrr; your kith will fall and your kin will too- then what will all of Moonshae do?
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
WOW, you are my hero.
Going to check out Death Gate as soon as humanly possible. Really though, have you tried ultima underworld two? It is a lot smoother and interesting than Eye of the Beholder. You know, 3d turning as opposed to NORTH EAST SOUTH WEST. Mixture between 3d and 2d objects, but what can you expect? You can obviously tell what rooms are which, and the environments are quite interesting.
I would say that it mainly focuses on puzzles and interaction with NPCs though combat is a big part of it. It's a tad bit difficult until you get the system down, but I guarantee a great experience if you haven't tried it already. I really really wish this series had taken off.
Going to check out Death Gate as soon as humanly possible. Really though, have you tried ultima underworld two? It is a lot smoother and interesting than Eye of the Beholder. You know, 3d turning as opposed to NORTH EAST SOUTH WEST. Mixture between 3d and 2d objects, but what can you expect? You can obviously tell what rooms are which, and the environments are quite interesting.
I would say that it mainly focuses on puzzles and interaction with NPCs though combat is a big part of it. It's a tad bit difficult until you get the system down, but I guarantee a great experience if you haven't tried it already. I really really wish this series had taken off.
Owlbears are the only thing keeping Arelith from the D&D experience.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Darklands, gods yes. Quite possibly one of my favourite games of all time. I'd rate this higher than everything that has ever been made post DOS.RED GANOT wrote:Darklands is also cool if you want a historical fantasy.
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Another day, another Doug.
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Pool of Radiance > Eye of the Beholder. Hillsfar is fun for a little while, but it's kind of short and lets you keep playing after you've beat it even though there's nothing to do, which could cause you to waste a fair amount of time trying to figure out if there's still something to do. I recently got my hands on a big pile of Ultima games, but haven't had much chance to play them yet.
Seriously, though. PoolRad.
Seriously, though. PoolRad.
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High Primate
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Betrayal at Krondor is amazing. Highly recommended.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
I'm guessing that the other two eye of the beholder games don't get better?
Owlbears are the only thing keeping Arelith from the D&D experience.
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The Man of the Moon
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
I totally fell in love with the Baldurs' Gate Saga... By far, my favourite!
Disclaimer: All what I write are simple opinions of a player and always with honest intention to contribute constructively and from respect, but with a poor knowledge of English.
Thank you
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Black Wendigo
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Ultima Underworld 2 is one of my favorite dungeon crawls, unless you count Balder's Gate 1/2 as such. If you are unfamiliar with the lore it may take a little getting used to, but it is a story in itself separate from the rest of the Ultima games. It's a pure dungeon crawl from start to finish but it goes to different worlds.
I liked the first Ultima Underworld as well, though that one is harder to deal with than the second game. Also the story wasn't much. It was fun shoving monsters off a cliff by hittinig them with arsenal that pushes them back.
The later Might and Magic games are also tops on my favorite games list. If you want a pure dungeon crawl that is a very big challenge , then the earlier ones are the way to go. The later ones have outdoor areas and lots of rpg elements. I also loved wizardry 7, a very tough game, and I still play wizardry 8.
Another game I really like is called Thunderscape a non d and d dungeon crawl that is somewhat of an unknown by now. It has some really big areas and like most games of the 90's you can break your game by doing something wrong. I was disappointed that it didn't sell and there was only one Thunderscape game.
I recommend a pencil and paper to map out the dungeons as most of these games don't have maps. Also note taking is a must to solve many of the puzzles.
I liked the first Ultima Underworld as well, though that one is harder to deal with than the second game. Also the story wasn't much. It was fun shoving monsters off a cliff by hittinig them with arsenal that pushes them back.
The later Might and Magic games are also tops on my favorite games list. If you want a pure dungeon crawl that is a very big challenge , then the earlier ones are the way to go. The later ones have outdoor areas and lots of rpg elements. I also loved wizardry 7, a very tough game, and I still play wizardry 8.
Another game I really like is called Thunderscape a non d and d dungeon crawl that is somewhat of an unknown by now. It has some really big areas and like most games of the 90's you can break your game by doing something wrong. I was disappointed that it didn't sell and there was only one Thunderscape game.
I recommend a pencil and paper to map out the dungeons as most of these games don't have maps. Also note taking is a must to solve many of the puzzles.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
I'm still looking for a game with Darkland's depth and atmosphere. Never managed to beat that damn dragon btw, or the Templars.
One of my personal retro favourite would be King of Dragon Pass.
Oh yeah, l'Empereur was also good, another of those weird strategy games Koei has the knack for, strategy and tactics in the Napoleonic era. It roughly resembles Romance of the Three Kingdoms for those who know that (Another wonderful game).
One of my personal retro favourite would be King of Dragon Pass.
Oh yeah, l'Empereur was also good, another of those weird strategy games Koei has the knack for, strategy and tactics in the Napoleonic era. It roughly resembles Romance of the Three Kingdoms for those who know that (Another wonderful game).
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Oh man, I lost years of my early life to Romance of Three Kingdoms series. Played hot seat with a buddy, good times. Also, the Ghengis series and Gemfire!
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
If we can inch into general retro, KoDP is indeed great. There is a sequel coming some time after 2016, which is worth looking forward to.
Other random picks: Arcanum, Avernum 1-3, Wizardry 8 as Wendigo said (Let's spawn level 50 demon horses while trying to get to the first town, shall we? This game has no mercy.), Might and Magic 7, Celtic Tales: Balor of the Evil Eye, Hammer of the Gods, Lords of the Realm 1-2, Wizards & Warriors (Heuristic Park), Conquest of the New World, Magic the Gathering: Shandalar. A mix of mostly strategy and or RPG in that list.
I am told that Moonstone: A Hard Day's Knight is awesome. But the screenshots make it look like a weird beat 'em up...
Koei are great. I adored their sailing games. Uncharted Waters. Really, really good RPG. I think you can actually get a DOS version of the second game. You could choose from six characters. All rounder, general, pirate (combat types), merchant, explorer, cartographer (peaceful types). All of these had their own story. They did Celtic Tales too.
Other random picks: Arcanum, Avernum 1-3, Wizardry 8 as Wendigo said (Let's spawn level 50 demon horses while trying to get to the first town, shall we? This game has no mercy.), Might and Magic 7, Celtic Tales: Balor of the Evil Eye, Hammer of the Gods, Lords of the Realm 1-2, Wizards & Warriors (Heuristic Park), Conquest of the New World, Magic the Gathering: Shandalar. A mix of mostly strategy and or RPG in that list.
I am told that Moonstone: A Hard Day's Knight is awesome. But the screenshots make it look like a weird beat 'em up...
Koei are great. I adored their sailing games. Uncharted Waters. Really, really good RPG. I think you can actually get a DOS version of the second game. You could choose from six characters. All rounder, general, pirate (combat types), merchant, explorer, cartographer (peaceful types). All of these had their own story. They did Celtic Tales too.
When my brood and I soar on wings of fire, and wreak our scourge over Caer Callidyrr; your kith will fall and your kin will too- then what will all of Moonshae do?
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Griefmaker
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
I will repeat the greatness of Ultima Underworld 2 and Betrayal at Krondor (heck, my user name is from Betrayal at Krondor, since it is just that awesome of a game). Also Manabi, if you liked the Underworld games, Arx Fatalis is the spiritual successor to those games (to me, it felt like Underworld, just without the Ultima lore and stuff like that). There is even a mode to change the graphics to those of Underworld if I recall correctly. Definitely worth checking out too. The only issue I had with this game was the spell casting. You actually have to draw the runes, which is not too bad when trying to save a spell for future casting, but in the heat of battle can be difficult. A cool innovation, but can be hard to pull off.
As far as the Eye of the Beholder games, I did not play the first one, though someone told me it was basically the same as the second. I finally beat the second one after a LONG several attempts and failures. It was amusing and I am glad I did it once, but have not really had much desire to return to it. Eye of the Beholder 3 added some cool new things, but I never did have the fortitude to finish it.
Arcanum is a wonderful game with a unique setting which actually got me back into computer gaming in the early 2000s. I still play that one on occasion because it is just totally cool (though can be very easy once you know what you are doing). As others have suggested, Might and Magic 7 (though I did enjoy 6-8, but 7 was the best of that group for me), wizardry 8, wizards and warriors was fun though it can be difficult to play on modern machines (XP and up for windows) and requires some tinkering.
As far as the Eye of the Beholder games, I did not play the first one, though someone told me it was basically the same as the second. I finally beat the second one after a LONG several attempts and failures. It was amusing and I am glad I did it once, but have not really had much desire to return to it. Eye of the Beholder 3 added some cool new things, but I never did have the fortitude to finish it.
Arcanum is a wonderful game with a unique setting which actually got me back into computer gaming in the early 2000s. I still play that one on occasion because it is just totally cool (though can be very easy once you know what you are doing). As others have suggested, Might and Magic 7 (though I did enjoy 6-8, but 7 was the best of that group for me), wizardry 8, wizards and warriors was fun though it can be difficult to play on modern machines (XP and up for windows) and requires some tinkering.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
In answer to the original question, I found the Eye of the Beholder series to be an excellent introduction to D&D for an utter noob like myself. The character creation is simple and easy to understand, the controls easy and well layed out. There are plenty of NPC's to meet and have in your party and the spells are simple and familiar.
Of course it lacks the depth of Baldur's Gate, but as a gentle introduction to the Forgotten Realms, I found it superb.
My favourite was the first one, to be honest. Play it with sound on, lights off and no other noises and it can get quite atmospheric! The second one kept much the same, and added a few improvements, including an outside area and puzzles, but I felt that once clear the dungeons and reach the three towers it loses its appeal for me.
The third was a very big let down. The graphics went backwards and the game play/story, I felt was awful.
Overall, it's a nice game series. Simple by today's standards, but at the time it was excellent.
I recommend you play them and enjoy the simplicity of character building without worrying about feats, tumble and cross classing into Bard.
Have fun!
Of course it lacks the depth of Baldur's Gate, but as a gentle introduction to the Forgotten Realms, I found it superb.
My favourite was the first one, to be honest. Play it with sound on, lights off and no other noises and it can get quite atmospheric! The second one kept much the same, and added a few improvements, including an outside area and puzzles, but I felt that once clear the dungeons and reach the three towers it loses its appeal for me.
The third was a very big let down. The graphics went backwards and the game play/story, I felt was awful.
Overall, it's a nice game series. Simple by today's standards, but at the time it was excellent.
I recommend you play them and enjoy the simplicity of character building without worrying about feats, tumble and cross classing into Bard.
Have fun!
Avon: Not enough! Not nearly enough! Dammit, what weighs seventy kilos?
Orac: Vila, weighs seventy three kilos, Avon.
Orac: Vila, weighs seventy three kilos, Avon.
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lordsterling
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Eye of the Beholder was just another taste in a long buffet of RPGs for me from back in the day. However, the one game that I could not put away until I finished it was 'A Faery Tale' on the Commodore Amiga...
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High Primate
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Rattus_norvegicus99
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Hrm, its not a DOS game, but one that is very similar in this genre, and at least 15 years old - Arcanum of Steamworks and Magick Obscura - loved that game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_O ... ck_Obscura
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_O ... ck_Obscura
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Arcanum was absolutely brilliant.Rattus_norvegicus99 wrote:Hrm, its not a DOS game, but one that is very similar in this genre, and at least 15 years old - Arcanum of Steamworks and Magick Obscura - loved that game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_O ... ck_Obscura
Owlbears are the only thing keeping Arelith from the D&D experience.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Yeah... Arcanum is freaking great. I put it in the same category as BG2 for quality CRPGs. Of course, if we're slipping out of DOS-era games, then there is no contender to the throne held by Planescape: Torment. This is, hands down, the finest CRPG ever made. The only weak spot is that goon fights aren't exactly thrilling, but that's not what it's for anyway.
Literally everything else, it does perfectly. The graphics looks dated now, but you won't care once you get going.The story is freaking incredible. Even random one-off NPCs are more rich, detailed, and thee-dimensional than major characters in many RPGs. The companions you can bring into your party... well, there's no Minsc, but every single one of them is more awesome than every single non-Minsc BG party member. There are games I was frustrated with the party size limit, but PS:T made me want to cry when I found enough of them that I couldn't bring everyone with me all the time anymore.
Also, I'm going to stop now, because I could probably go on all day, and you shouldn't be reading me telling you how great it is, you should be playing it.
Literally everything else, it does perfectly. The graphics looks dated now, but you won't care once you get going.The story is freaking incredible. Even random one-off NPCs are more rich, detailed, and thee-dimensional than major characters in many RPGs. The companions you can bring into your party... well, there's no Minsc, but every single one of them is more awesome than every single non-Minsc BG party member. There are games I was frustrated with the party size limit, but PS:T made me want to cry when I found enough of them that I couldn't bring everyone with me all the time anymore.
Also, I'm going to stop now, because I could probably go on all day, and you shouldn't be reading me telling you how great it is, you should be playing it.
Layla Rashmi: Fighting off alien monsters and sleeping with Amazon Moon Maidens... FOR SCIENCE!
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
omg no don't
they're trolling you
that one with the cameras i couldn't even get past it
When my brood and I soar on wings of fire, and wreak our scourge over Caer Callidyrr; your kith will fall and your kin will too- then what will all of Moonshae do?
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Black Wendigo
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Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Here is one of the greatest things about Arcanum: You can play it on all versions of windows since its inception. I have it on 8.1 and while there is a little issue with choppiness, the game is extremely playable from its original disks. That's right I have 15 year old games in my library. 
Last time I played Baldur's Gate 2 from original disks it was working under Windows 7. Only thing is I could not use the original patches for the game.
I'm surprised at how many really old games I have that can work under Windows still, though some need fan made patches to fix certain issues.
Last time I played Baldur's Gate 2 from original disks it was working under Windows 7. Only thing is I could not use the original patches for the game.
I'm surprised at how many really old games I have that can work under Windows still, though some need fan made patches to fix certain issues.
Re: D&D Eye of the Beholder (MS-DOS)
Planescape Torment. Yes. Win. Victory. Endure, in enduring grow strong.
Another game that has flown under the radar is Sword of the Samurai. The pixel art in this is phenomenal. Basically you play as a minor feudal lord during the Shogunate period of Japan, and you pretty much try to climb the ranks and become Shogun of Japan. It's not set out like traditional rpgs, in fact I'd go to say it's more like a role playing strategy. I lost so many hours of my youth playing this.
Another game that has flown under the radar is Sword of the Samurai. The pixel art in this is phenomenal. Basically you play as a minor feudal lord during the Shogunate period of Japan, and you pretty much try to climb the ranks and become Shogun of Japan. It's not set out like traditional rpgs, in fact I'd go to say it's more like a role playing strategy. I lost so many hours of my youth playing this.
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Another day, another Doug.
Another day, another Doug.