Deryliss wrote: ↑Fri Jan 22, 2021 11:12 am
Andunor then was much more openly about internal conflict. Most of my early RP in Andunor was centered around the hostilities between the Devil's Table and the Sharps, on spies, backstabbery and infiltration. Much of the RP was inward focused, and in some cases drawn across racial lines very clearly. Surface conflict was the very rare time in which any unity was shown, and it would quickly dissolve into more backstabbery once the fight was over.
Andunor now is almost entirely outwardly focused. It's all about deep vs surface, and creating a 'united Andunor' that can hold its own against the surface one day even conquer it maybe. Groups that once would have had to treat very, very lightly in Andunor are now accepted with open arms as allies and spoken highly of between residents. One drow unironically spoke the words "I'm proud that Andunor is such a diverse and inclusive place" in the hub a few days back, in reference to the increased Zhentarim and Sharran presence in the city.
I am unsure if I can even put into words how much I miss the Andunor of the first paragraph. It's a really conflicting feeling. I love the city feeling unsafe and backstabby. I love there being constant danger and having to actually
work for plans/alliances/etc to be put into motion when there's a greater purpose. I love the entire aesthetic and feeling of a city that
does not care about its citizens unless they force a reason to care.
But I don't miss the constant OOC salt and behaviours, the reams of people getting banned after city-wide wars, the sense that every single little conflict has to turn into a huge sword contest of who has more allies to dunk on the other.
People say Andunor is supposed to be like Skullport, but that's something rarely actually enforced. To clarify before my next words are taken out of proportion, no I don't think surfacers should be flaunting walking through willy-nilly. But I think no one should actually care if they are unless they have been personally wronged (or have some way they can benefit). I have an ideal vision of Andunor that I’ll attempt to parse out here.
~~~~~
There is a city of monsters, outcasts, and other creatures in the Underdark.
People who make it there, for whatever reason, are either looking for a refuge that they cannot get on the surface, a stomping ground to gain power and make their mark, a market that doesn’t question where the coin comes from or what it’s for, or some other assumedly dastardly and selfish reason.
Traders come and go. Travelers come and go. All who pass through or even live there, do so with the understanding that unless they can ensure of it with their own power, they are not safe. One needs to be good at passing unnoticed, or a quick talker, or even fast with showing a bit of coin in case they’re harried. Everyone can be expected to be there for selfish reasons. If you trust someone not to stab you in the back without something to appeal to their selfish nature, you might as well expect a knife in the back.
The city does not care about the citizens. The citizens know the city does not care. If an individual acts in their own self-interest and ends up doing so in a way that harms another individual, no one should be expected to come to the victim’s defense. The ruling Houses and Embassy do not care about the individual. The Hubmaster does not care about the individual. The Peacekeepers will stand by and watch any conflict between citizens until the moment that it turns into a mass-combat. Squabbles between a few gangs do not disrupt the “tradepeace” as long as they start and end quickly.
That is why Andunor, the city itself, does not have laws except in the occasional word from the Hubmaster or ruling powers. But they’re not written.
Andunor does not expect loyalty to Andunor unless loyalty is in the form of taxes and citizenship. The only loyalty Andunor requires is in writs being performed, shopfronts used, the bars frequented, and the districts paying their dues.
Districts, however, are free to demand loyalty. They thrive off of it and might even
need it to keep up with demands of resources. Districts have elections so the ruling Houses and Embassy can delegate the headache of menial government. The elected leaders are free to hire guards, set laws, and yes, attract
loyalty in order to ensure all their citizens keep up with what is needed.
But no district has a say over what the other does. And no district has a say outside of their own borders. Any district leader can say they do, but no one is required to believe them. And if someone happens to act against the interests of a particular district, the only power the district has against them is within the bounds of the district or by hired cronies if they wish to pursue it.
Andunor does not care if someone acted against a district. One district does not care if someone acted against another district unless it actively harms an agreement, alliance, trade deal, or plan.
And of factions?
Of course, various monsters or other types will group up or tribalize. There is strength in numbers and power to it. However, such things are rarely stable. Two Houses may have a similar goal, but as soon as the goal is reached, or even in the midst of it, they have no obligation to continue the alliance. A goblin and a kobold may have an understanding that they cannot complete a writ without the aid of the other, but in the end, a goblin might be eyeing that shiny dagger on the kobold’s belt, and the kobold might be thinking of a roasted goblin thigh.
Alliances are most often seen as a hindrance. After all, why should one be held back from their nature unless it’s sufficiently self-serving? Two clans might have an agreement, but rarely do monsters or various evils align so perfectly on every single thing that it lasts too long. Raids are definitely a reason to align, but they can be a dangerous and risky operation that require planning and care, and last until the spoils are divided and the groups that made it up go back to their own holes.
Andunor is a trade city. It’s not a war city. The ruling powers care more about serving their own purposes and making money than they do about anything else. Districts want a reason to one-up others and give reason to be rewarded. Perhaps it’s rumored that if one bolsters their ruling House or Embassy’s coffers enough, they will be rewarded.
It is also said that if too many factions align as one, the ruling powers start to get uneasy. After all, who would be comfortable with a growing army in their own backyard? Who would want hundreds of evil beings suddenly finding a common purpose
and who would want to risk that common purpose being toppling Freth, Claddath, and Gracklestugh? Few tyrants would look favorably on their minions suddenly getting along well. Too well. Because if they’re not fighting each other, chances are that they’re looking above them.
Andunor itself does not declare war on the surface. War is costly. It has little gain when the city itself is full of such fractured peoples. One could expect a city where every lesser citizen is cowed into subservience to do something like that, but Andunor first and foremost cares about trade and who comes to do trade. It can’t constantly be looking above when there is so much below that is seeking to drag it down, and if ever Andunor united to burn the surface of Arelith, the ruling powers could quickly expect a horde of illithid that have been watching for this moment.
Perhaps some citizens of Andunor have an undying hatred for all of surface. Perhaps some only care about a few races. Kobolds and gnomes. Drow and elves. Duergar and shield dwarves. Some might not even care at all so long as whatever that thing was, didn’t harm them. The few non-monsters who slip down to the underdark, well, who knows their story? Perhaps they truly were outcasted. Perhaps they’re simply looking for a tutor in darker arts. Perhaps they’re scanning the faces of slaves with downcast eyes, hoping to find a loved one there and willing to risk anything for it. And yes, perhaps some are there to look for a crack in the city that can be exploited.
Few care why, as long as they can either go unnoticed or pay their way somehow to ensure no one looks too closely.
But for those who are looking for a way Andunor can be targeted, they’re left at a loss.
Andunor cannot be targeted because Andunor does not care.
Despite Andunor having so many fractured parts, the wheel of Andunor keeps on turning.
Someone can target one faction or group, and do no harm to the city as a whole, because the city does not care. If some are killed or weakened, they likely would have fallen anyway. And the city is unforgiving to weakness.
But because the city does not care about some of the parts, the city recovers from loss of some of the parts.
One District can be weakened. Maybe two. Maybe even three, but for that to happen, it would mean significant effort on the part of any to try and take out three districts that do not already act as one.
But Andunor recovers. It survives. It endures.
No one in Andunor should expect to be safe. No one should give trust lightly or expect anyone to trust them. No one should think that enjoying someone’s company is reason enough for them not to turn on them when a better option presents itself. The Underdark does not show mercy. If someone is beckoned alone into a room with one exist, they should think twice. If someone is freely offered a drink, they should expect poison.
If someone sees a human that they hadn’t seen before, or a dwarf or a gnome or a halfling, their first thought shouldn’t be “this person is trying to harm the city” because the city does not care. The city will not reward loyalty, nor should someone expect loyalty. Maybe they shouldn’t care. Maybe they should think about “what can they offer me if I am right about them not being supposed to be here”. Maybe they should think “that person managed to get down here, so they must be powerful enough that they could be of use to me”.
Maybe if they see a someone suspicious (is anyone not suspicious in Andunor?) going somewhere they shouldn’t be, like snooping around the door of a House, or talking to the seneschal of a district and writing what is said, they could act. If it is in their interests.
But just anyone passing through hub and taking a look at the board… well, if someone can learn sensitive information from the public hub board, maybe the fault is of the one who posted it in the first place.
And if someone gets into a fight and loses?
Andunor doesn’t care.
Maybe their own tribe will care. Or maybe their own clan will laugh at them for being so weak, because being defeated is a shameful thing. Maybe they should have run away and hidden, because the law of the Underdark is survival, and survival has no room for things like shame or honor save for a few species or codes. Maybe their group will even strike back at the attacker if they’re a loner and it won’t bring back undue attention. But if the cost outweighs the satisfaction of revenge, if retaliation will cause more retaliation, then, well, is it worth it? Especially if it gets too big, no one wants the ruling powers to step in. Don't make a privy out of your dining room. Best to catch someone off their guard and out of the city if at all.
Maybe they can pay someone to get their attacker back. After all, there is a convenient assassin’s guild. But most likely, someone will lick their wounds and thank whatever gods they had that their life was preserved enough for them to drag themselves to safety, and they will continue to survive and endure until they are strong enough.
Whatever happens? Andunor does not care.
~~~~~
This is the Andunor I dream of and would love to play in. I'm not actually sure if it's possible. I think a large hindrance to an Andunor like this is player ego.
Players hate to lose. Players hate to start conflicts they think they'll lose. Players like the idea of having an enemy that's not in their own home. This is where big city alliances, surfacer-outing, and wars against the surface come from. On that note, players also love raids, love to feel like they're part of a whole, and love to feel included. It's a great feeling, I will admit, to feel like you're all in this together.
But that's not really healthy, funnily enough, to Andunor rp and Arelith as a whole. It means people are unwilling to turn against their friends or allies for the sake of moving forward story. This is why Andunor has felt stagnant and and buddy buddy (except for the occasional blown out of proportion wars). There is not enough little casual conflicts.
I'd rather have an Andunor that doesn't
care about some random surfacer that they've never seen before because there's so much more to care about. There's political power plays, dark rituals, exploration, figuring out how to kidnap that goblin who called you a rat-lizard so you can strike the fear of your gods into them, there's money to be made and weird magic to experiment with. Drow are hunting an elf in the city? Find them first and convince them to give you a nice shiny gem so you won't give them up!
Why does everything have to be centered around the surface?
Also, for that matter, I'm a firm believer that the Skal passage to Andunor should be blocked for 10 rpr (or people who haven't played for a couple weeks or months) so we don't have sun elves running around in the hub because a new player didn't realize the full extent of where they were going.