Hostile Interactions, Mass PvP, Transition Abuse and Bad Blood
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 5:43 pm
As many of you know it is not generally my policy to address specific instances and complaints here on the forum, and players are asked not to do the same. The reasons for this, if not already apparent, are not easily discussed without forming a whole new thread on the subject, which I'm not currently intending. However there was a recent event which was, effectively, a repetition of a scenario played out a great many times over the years – the same patterns, the same complaints and accusations and the same resulting demotivation among many of our veteran players. Rather than answer a number of individual PMs, appeals and reports, I want to talk about the issue more broadly, and notify players of a resulting mechanical change coming to Arelith today, one I hope may serve to limit such problems in future.
More broadly then; I spend a lot of my time dealing with the fallout from hostile encounters between players, almost every time there is a raid, a pirate invasion, a confrontation with Banites, settlement conflict, or any large scale PvP, there are people coming away from it aggrieved in some way – sometimes with their fellow players, sometimes with staff, core mechanics or server rules (and of course sometimes this can be entirely correct). I've been known to publicly wonder why it is that certain players build and play spoiling for a fight, but can seem so incapable of actual enjoying it with just getting mad as hell? I admit, this is cynical on my part, but I ask why people are clearly putting themselves in a position that will provoke PVP encounters, while not really being able to handle the consequences – the other side cheated, the DMs were bias, it was metagamed – there so often seems to be a reason why the outcome was unfair.
As a player I see this too, I think many of you have. Getting bombarded with tells by a player raging over someone else's behavior, people privately calling out other factions on Discord for being a collection of trolling ne'er-do-well's that blight the server to satisfy their own to grandstanding power trips. X is metagamer, Y is an elitist troll. There is a reason why some players run a mile at the hint of PvP, or would rather it wasn't a feature of Arelith at all, while others can quit as a result of it.
One thing I constantly repeat when mediating such conflicts is to trying to help one group see another is not all bad. To diffuse the bad blood, and encourage a more objective view. We all get tunnel vision when limited to our group channels or friend grounds, but the truth is, when one group of players believe another has acted badly, the same is often entirely true in the other direction, and always the truth is somewhere in-between. Navigating this, for our DM Team can be an absolute minefield, in one single ruling they might be called out as heavy handed, deaf to complaints, complacent, playing favorites or morally negligent by different parties involved. There is rarely one clear way to apportion blame, and rarely one fix-all solution.
Personally, I like PvP. I always have. I like the feeling of my pulse racing, the excitement as my hand trembles on the quick slots, the heightened emotions and potential consequences, but, possibly because of this, we often operate on a hair trigger – the PvP itself isn't a problem, but rather how quickly it escalates – there is barely room to roleplay at all before someone instigates the firefight.
A band of pirates is seen entering Nexus Falls, there are drow in the forest, or surfacers descending the Minmir Caves. A lynch party is quickly formed, buffs are deployed and players start running towards the enemy. There is only time for a few lines of roleplay before the AoE's are firing, and so very often it just feels like a wasted opportunity, an anti-climatic mess, and people come away from the encounter feeling royally pissed off to have been subjected to it.
Yet, it almost always happens exactly that way - If the definition of madness is truly repeating the same behavior and expecting a different result, then Arelith really is an asylum for the deranged.
I know it is hard, but, well, here are a few bullet points that may help.
- Please try to give space for a narrative, and for roleplay. If you see a group of your enemies, try engaging them in RP, developing a story together. Sometimes the PvP will not be necessary, and very least it may be more sensible. Why not the two leaders challenge themselves to a duel? Or one group swallows their pride and backs down? In the end this may be more rewarding. Even if it's only a few more minutes of actual roleplay before the killing starts, many might enjoy it more.
- Don't go starting a fight if you can't finish it, or rather handle the consequences. If 15 pirates go marching into the Radiant Heart don't be too shocked if it soons descends into chaos.
- Remember NWN is not Warhammer Fantasy Battle – large scale battles just don't work. There will be performance issues, and it is unlikely to be an enjoyable experience.
Finally a word on transitions, and the ability to abuse them. Such fallout from PVP events routinely features reports of transition abuse – players retransitioning over and over, or dying from AoE spells before they've loaded into an area. Of course laying down an AoE over an area transition is a clear rule break, and will be answered by the DM team, but it can also simply happen by accident, or at least be unavoidable if that is where the fighting is taking place, and often does.
I've therefore asked the development staff, today, to update our scripts so characters will remain invulnerable for 3 seconds after transitioning into a new areas. This will be on a roughly 20 second cooldown, so don't expect to avoid death indefinitely by endless switching areas. We are also looking at the possibly of adding a further 6 second cooldown before one can transition again.
So after you transition to a new area
- You are invulnerable for 3 seconds
- Cannot transition again for a further 6 seconds
- Will not receive transition invulnerability more than once in a 20 second period.
I hope some of the above insight and changes help, and I'd ask that players do not respond to this thread by naming specific instances of PvP, or by calling out other players and factions, but by all means share any thoughts or input on the topic (PLEASE in a friendly manner). There are always two sides to such stories, and I hate to see bad blood form within our community as a result of something which should ideally be fun for all of us.
More broadly then; I spend a lot of my time dealing with the fallout from hostile encounters between players, almost every time there is a raid, a pirate invasion, a confrontation with Banites, settlement conflict, or any large scale PvP, there are people coming away from it aggrieved in some way – sometimes with their fellow players, sometimes with staff, core mechanics or server rules (and of course sometimes this can be entirely correct). I've been known to publicly wonder why it is that certain players build and play spoiling for a fight, but can seem so incapable of actual enjoying it with just getting mad as hell? I admit, this is cynical on my part, but I ask why people are clearly putting themselves in a position that will provoke PVP encounters, while not really being able to handle the consequences – the other side cheated, the DMs were bias, it was metagamed – there so often seems to be a reason why the outcome was unfair.
As a player I see this too, I think many of you have. Getting bombarded with tells by a player raging over someone else's behavior, people privately calling out other factions on Discord for being a collection of trolling ne'er-do-well's that blight the server to satisfy their own to grandstanding power trips. X is metagamer, Y is an elitist troll. There is a reason why some players run a mile at the hint of PvP, or would rather it wasn't a feature of Arelith at all, while others can quit as a result of it.
One thing I constantly repeat when mediating such conflicts is to trying to help one group see another is not all bad. To diffuse the bad blood, and encourage a more objective view. We all get tunnel vision when limited to our group channels or friend grounds, but the truth is, when one group of players believe another has acted badly, the same is often entirely true in the other direction, and always the truth is somewhere in-between. Navigating this, for our DM Team can be an absolute minefield, in one single ruling they might be called out as heavy handed, deaf to complaints, complacent, playing favorites or morally negligent by different parties involved. There is rarely one clear way to apportion blame, and rarely one fix-all solution.
Personally, I like PvP. I always have. I like the feeling of my pulse racing, the excitement as my hand trembles on the quick slots, the heightened emotions and potential consequences, but, possibly because of this, we often operate on a hair trigger – the PvP itself isn't a problem, but rather how quickly it escalates – there is barely room to roleplay at all before someone instigates the firefight.
A band of pirates is seen entering Nexus Falls, there are drow in the forest, or surfacers descending the Minmir Caves. A lynch party is quickly formed, buffs are deployed and players start running towards the enemy. There is only time for a few lines of roleplay before the AoE's are firing, and so very often it just feels like a wasted opportunity, an anti-climatic mess, and people come away from the encounter feeling royally pissed off to have been subjected to it.
Yet, it almost always happens exactly that way - If the definition of madness is truly repeating the same behavior and expecting a different result, then Arelith really is an asylum for the deranged.
I know it is hard, but, well, here are a few bullet points that may help.
- Please try to give space for a narrative, and for roleplay. If you see a group of your enemies, try engaging them in RP, developing a story together. Sometimes the PvP will not be necessary, and very least it may be more sensible. Why not the two leaders challenge themselves to a duel? Or one group swallows their pride and backs down? In the end this may be more rewarding. Even if it's only a few more minutes of actual roleplay before the killing starts, many might enjoy it more.
- Don't go starting a fight if you can't finish it, or rather handle the consequences. If 15 pirates go marching into the Radiant Heart don't be too shocked if it soons descends into chaos.
- Remember NWN is not Warhammer Fantasy Battle – large scale battles just don't work. There will be performance issues, and it is unlikely to be an enjoyable experience.
Finally a word on transitions, and the ability to abuse them. Such fallout from PVP events routinely features reports of transition abuse – players retransitioning over and over, or dying from AoE spells before they've loaded into an area. Of course laying down an AoE over an area transition is a clear rule break, and will be answered by the DM team, but it can also simply happen by accident, or at least be unavoidable if that is where the fighting is taking place, and often does.
I've therefore asked the development staff, today, to update our scripts so characters will remain invulnerable for 3 seconds after transitioning into a new areas. This will be on a roughly 20 second cooldown, so don't expect to avoid death indefinitely by endless switching areas. We are also looking at the possibly of adding a further 6 second cooldown before one can transition again.
So after you transition to a new area
- You are invulnerable for 3 seconds
- Cannot transition again for a further 6 seconds
- Will not receive transition invulnerability more than once in a 20 second period.
I hope some of the above insight and changes help, and I'd ask that players do not respond to this thread by naming specific instances of PvP, or by calling out other players and factions, but by all means share any thoughts or input on the topic (PLEASE in a friendly manner). There are always two sides to such stories, and I hate to see bad blood form within our community as a result of something which should ideally be fun for all of us.