Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

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Void
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Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by Void » Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:53 pm

Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

I mean, it is supposed to detect invisible creatures nearby, but the range of that isn't really great, as far as I know.

If a character already has spot, is there a lot of reason to invest into listen?
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MRFTW
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by MRFTW » Sun Dec 12, 2021 4:47 am

Void wrote:
Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:53 pm
If a character already has spot, is there a lot of reason to invest into listen?
It's harder for sneakers to get high move silently than it is for them to get high hide (although the numbers are still silly for players)

It's generally considered that spot is for breaking disguises, and listen is for finding sneakers.

Out of the two, I prefer listen, as it sometimes lets you perceive enemies behind walls sometimes.

Eyeliner
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by Eyeliner » Sun Dec 12, 2021 5:19 am

I believe spot is much better if you want to attack stealthed enemies.

Listen's main advantage is probably that sneaks tend to have higher hide than move silently (shadowdancer bonus, camouflage spell and some gear will raise hide but not MS) so it should work more often with less gear and feat investment.

Myself, I wouldn't bother with listen and just go spot all the way. I don't think you need both. Some classes used to have one or the other which would make the decision for you but I am pretty sure most of those were updated to have the choice of either now.

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MissEvelyn
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by MissEvelyn » Sun Dec 12, 2021 5:38 am

If I'm not mistaken, Listen increases the range you'll hear /whispers. So if you want a character that's great at eavesdropping, it's worth investing in 🙂


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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by dallion43 » Sun Dec 12, 2021 7:31 am

Listen doesn't need line of sight. If you have both Listen and Spot you effectively roll twice. Amplify pot. I can carefully say it is easier to win vs MS then vs Hide in most cases. Listen is useful for a melee (corners). Imho of course.
The other side of the coin? Silence pot.

Listen vs Spot? It is up to debate, but the sheer amount of "" I seen recently elevates Spot to a higher position.

Void
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by Void » Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:12 am

Alright htanks for the info. THe reason for asking is that I was evaluating a possible build and ended up in situation where I can't fit in both like I normally would do (because the race has -2 int penalty)
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MRFTW
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by MRFTW » Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:04 pm

MissEvelyn wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 5:38 am
If I'm not mistaken, Listen increases the range you'll hear /whispers. So if you want a character that's great at eavesdropping, it's worth investing in 🙂
Is that true? I had no idea and that's kind of a big deal if so.

It's also worth noting that unless you're specifically trying to make a spotter/listener build, a dedicated sneaker is going to get past you anyway. Their numbers really are ludicrous and not matchable by a reasonable spotter.

Void
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by Void » Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:42 pm

MRFTW wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:04 pm
Is that true? I had no idea and that's kind of a big deal if so.
It's not. I've never noticed this sort of effect on character with dedicated listen and it is not documented anywhere.

Additionaly, listen does not QUITE work without line of sight. You have to be in the same room. If you stand before a closed door, you can't hear what's beyond it, regardless of listen rank.

In Andunor hub, most of the people present light up as "invisible" even if you do not have line of sight to them., because apparently the "room" is the same. That happens even with zero listen skill.
MRFTW wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:04 pm
It's also worth noting that unless you're specifically trying to make a spotter/listener build, a dedicated sneaker is going to get past you anyway. Their numbers really are ludicrous and not matchable by a reasonable spotter.
There are dedicated spotters which rise their skill to even higher degree than dedicated sneaks. Thankfully, their number is single digits.
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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by Eyeliner » Sun Dec 12, 2021 11:51 pm

Just to reiterate, I think when you hear someone with listen you aren't necessarily able to target them. I am not sure of the exact rules or conditions on this as it's been a while since I've been a good listener. As my RL partner would probably agree.

Whereas if you spot someone you seem to always be able to target them. That would particularly make a difference fighting corner sneaking rogues.

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Re: Does listen skill have a lot of practical use?

Post by MissEvelyn » Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:01 am

Void wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:42 pm
MRFTW wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:04 pm
Is that true? I had no idea and that's kind of a big deal if so.
It's not. I've never noticed this sort of effect on character with dedicated listen and it is not documented anywhere.

Additionaly, listen does not QUITE work without line of sight. You have to be in the same room. If you stand before a closed door, you can't hear what's beyond it, regardless of listen rank.

In Andunor hub, most of the people present light up as "invisible" even if you do not have line of sight to them., because apparently the "room" is the same. That happens even with zero listen skill.
That's what I thought.

It used to be true pre-EE days, if I remember correctly. Both the distance words would travel to someone with Listen, as well as being able to listen through rooms/door. So speakers you couldn't see in the other room would show up in the chat log as "Unknown Speaker".

Since Enhanced Edition I have never once seen "Unkown Speaker" in the chat log.


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