Viable Necromancer

[legionetrangere]

Howdy

I'm ironing out a necromancer build, 27 wizard 3 warlock (pale master is not an option i'm willing to consider btw)

1) I'm thinking on taking specialist route, I'm not into PVP and could live without divination spells. Is it worth it?
2) I'm also thinking on taking ES mummy dust, is it worth it considering my toon already is a specialist?
3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

[In Sorrow We Trust]

3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

Maybe soon. Who knows.

[Maladus]

1) I'm thinking on taking specialist route, I'm not into PVP and could live without divination spells. Is it worth it?

Specialist is almost never worth it. Losing an entire spell school is a lot to give up, even with the changes made to specialists on Arelith.

2) I'm also thinking on taking ES mummy dust, is it worth it considering my toon already is a specialist?

Yes

3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

Not right now, but you can download an override to make the creatures look cooler.

[legionetrangere]

1) I'm thinking on taking specialist route, I'm not into PVP and could live without divination spells. Is it worth it?

Specialist is almost never worth it. Losing an entire spell school is a lot to give up, even with the changes made to specialists on Arelith.

2) I'm also thinking on taking ES mummy dust, is it worth it considering my toon already is a specialist?

Yes

3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

Not right now, but you can download an override to make the creatures look cooler.

Is it redundant taking both specialist necromancer and ES mummy dust?

[Maladus]

Is it redundant taking both specialist necromancer and ES mummy dust?

No because Mummy Dust is the only way you get access to the strongest undead summons.

[-XXX-]

Forget about the necro specialist UCL +2 bit, it's a QoL lvling perk that's only relevant during pre-epic lvls.
A character must take the mummy dust feat to enable tier 6 and tier 7 undead.
The entire point of the necro specialist is that they can summon two tier 7 undead which can only be summonned with the mummy dust feat.
It's pretty much the single most important feat for them.

[Aelryn Bloodmoon]

Specialist is almost never worth it. Losing an entire spell school is a lot to give up, even with the changes made to specialists on Arelith.

Hot Take- Specialist Wizards are a better choice than sorcerers in terms of spellcasting access, always.

Mathematical proof follows this hot take.

In Vanilla, there are 172 wizard/sorcerer spells to learn from, not counting cantrips.

Not counting cantrips, a sorcerer learns 34 spells total, by level 20, and never learns another spell after that. They can cast 6 spells per spell level per rest.

A specialist wizard casts 25% more spells than a generalist wizard (5 spells per spell level per rest instead of 4), keeps all the metamagic, and gives up (at most) access to 28 spells.

A sorcerer, to cast 20% more spells than a specialist wizard (6 instead of 5), sacrifices: four(they get brew potion here) metamagic feats, and access to more than 100 spells known than a specialist wizard. The cost here for 20% more spells per day is drastically higher than the cost a specialist pays over a generalist for an increase of 25%.

In terms of pure spellcasting access, sorcerer is the biggest sacrifice in the game, and gives up literally hundreds of more spells than any specialist. There are exactly two conditions in which a casting-focused sorcerer is better than a specialist wizard.

1: You're planning to still spell cast in heavy armor WITH a div dip and divine shield
2: You hate/can't be bothered/don't know the game well enough to prepare spells in advance.

[Eyeliner]

I wouldn't listen to blanket statement that all specialists are bad. There's so many variables to consider, that just tells me the person don't care enough to give them a closer look. It's fine if you're not interested in making them work but don't tell people who are that they universally suck. That said, don't ever play a conjuration specialist

The two spells you'll really miss are true seeing and premonition. Both of which are a little painful to give up. You'll want to max out spot on the warlock dip and figure out how to get see invisibility, etc from items. Greater stoneskin helps but it isn't premonition. Other than that necromancy specialists are worth it just for the extra 6-7-8-9 slots alone.

All that said, undeath cleric or undying warlock are probably better necromancer options in 2022 Arelith just because wizards as a whole feel a bit underwhelming. If you specifically want the wizard RP it's a solid choice and you should stick with it-- just saying if the necro-friends angle is the draw then look at your options.

[legionetrangere]

Just want to make sure I'm not doing something stupid by going both necro specialist AND epic mummy dust. lol
I don't want to waste either the feat, or the spells by going necro without seeing the homies zombies stronger when taking both options

[-XXX-]

I strongly suggest testing the build on PGCC with and without the feat for comparison.

[Hunter548]

Specialist is almost never worth it. Losing an entire spell school is a lot to give up, even with the changes made to specialists on Arelith.

Hot Take- Specialist Wizards are a better choice than sorcerers in terms of spellcasting access, always.

Mathematical proof follows this hot take.

In Vanilla, there are 172 wizard/sorcerer spells to learn from, not counting cantrips.

Not counting cantrips, a sorcerer learns 34 spells total, by level 20, and never learns another spell after that. They can cast 6 spells per spell level per rest.

In terms of pure spellcasting access, sorcerer is the biggest sacrifice in the game, and gives up literally hundreds of more spells than any specialist. There are exactly two conditions in which a casting-focused sorcerer is better than a specialist wizard.

1: You're planning to still spell cast in heavy armor WITH a div dip and divine shield
2: You hate/can't be bothered/don't know the game well enough to prepare spells in advance.

This is really only true if you assume every (or even a majority or plurity) of those spells are actually good enough that they're irreplaceable. Most of them aren't even particularly good.



For what it's worth, OP: Not all wizard specializations are bad, but necromancy is one of the ones I think is pretty bad. Giving up See Invisibility and True Seeing is very painful. You do however absolutely want Mummy Dust; as outlined above, you can't get the strongest summons without it. Unfortunately I also think that an enchanter specialist wizard with ESF necromancy and Mummy Dust is probably a better necromancy summoner than a necromancy specialist.

(It's also worth noting that at least on a mechanical level Planar Conduit is inexplicably way better than Mummy Dust at the moment, and both fill the same niche. The Conduit summons have an absurd 10-15ish more ab than the Mummy Dust ones do.)

[Eyeliner]

It's getting into some off-meta territory but yeah another specialty might serve a necromancer better. If you're going the necro-route with summons anyway it could be a time to give up conjuration and be an abjurer with extra-potent breaches or an evoker. Or be a diviner with extra-long true sight and +7 premonition. Enchantment is a great recommendation though and that means you can have mummy dust plus two dominated creatures in your stable.

[Waldo52]

3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

Maybe soon. Who knows.

This has always been a problem for me. The whole mummy thing is so random and Egyptian, the people demand end game zombies or ghouls.

Please don't retort with this vampire stream nonsense, the people demand zombies or ghouls.

[legionetrangere]

3) I already know the answer to this, but I'll pretend I don't know: Is it possible to change the skin of the mummies to a regular zombie? Mummies are ugly and makes me think i'll have to dig pyramids to find viable corpses, whereas armored zombies i could just go to Cordor graveyard and raise King Edward's uncle, who was in the cordor guard. Bottom end, mummies look ugly, armored zombies look cool.

Maybe soon. Who knows.

This has always been a problem for me. The whole mummy thing is so random and Egyptian, the people demand end game zombies or ghouls.

Please don't retort with this vampire stream nonsense, the people demand zombies or ghouls.

Maybe just add another stream using mummy stats but with different models, i'm sure people would be fine with that. Better than using pharaohs and draculas around lol