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Use Trap mechanics and calculations

Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 4:50 pm
by Omicron

According to wikipedia, when using player-used traps, only hard-ranks count into the calculations.

To my understanding, hard-ranks are definitely every single point one puts into the skills every level, resulting in 33 at max level. However what comes later? I figured from asking other players that "soft-ranks" is anything I get from enchanted gear and will not count towards Use Trap. However, what about feats and certain other sources of skill bonuses? I will list them as follows.

  • Dexterity Ability Modifier bonus

  • Skill Focus and Epic Skill Focus (+5 and +10)

  • Skill Mastery (+4 to Set Trap)

  • Bard songs

  • Rogue Cunning spell (temporary +5)

If there are any other sources of HARD skills, I would like to know or get attention of developers/admins of this server for a definitive answer. Thank you in advance


Re: Use Trap mechanics and calculations

Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 7:44 pm
by Takes

Having 5 or more ranks in the disable trap skill grants a +2 synergy bonus on set trap checks.

Not sure if this counts either. Before the traps change and in vanilla nwn it matter because you are trying to hit certain benchmarks to set certain traps. On the current arelith I do not know.


Re: Use Trap mechanics and calculations

Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 9:40 pm
by Waldo52

This is a problem I've pointed out before in the feedback and suggestions areas. Use trap generally doesn't reward deep investment. Your hard ranks, dex modifier and bonuses from rogue levels set the actual DC that enemies roll against to determine the actual effects of a trap. Any further skill investment (skill focus, gear, etc.) will only increase two things:

-How hard your traps are to detect (irrelevant in PvE and extremely situational in PvP)

-How hard your traps are to disarm (irrelevant in PvE and extremely, profoundly situational in PvP)

From what I've seen only your dexterity modifier, the every five levels of rogue bonus and HARD ranks in set trap that will effect how strong your traps will be. Ironically, once you've done what you have to do with Use Traps, taking gruesome technique going full ham with the intimidate skill is the only way I know of to exploit current game mechanics for traps that are stronger in any meaningful way.


Re: Use Trap mechanics and calculations

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 12:04 am
by Omicron

Damage is directly proportional to hard ranks in Use Trap. Hence I ask whether any of the above feats and other sources of Use Trap count as hard or soft.

Taking most extreme possible trap, right from the wiki:

Extreme quality trap

HSTS * (2 + 1/3) d4s

HSTS Stands for your Hard Ranks in Use Traps.


Re: Use Trap mechanics and calculations

Posted: Sat Jul 29, 2023 12:45 am
by Tikin

Here the Hard Ranks are the ones you can take as skill points purely, so maximum=33, and nothing else

as a witness the table in wiki says lvl 30 average 192.5 damage
because: 33 (hard skill ranks) x (2+1/3) = 77, average d4 is 2.5, and 77x2.5 is 192.5

Waldo explained well how the whole thing work I believe :-)

Have fun ;-)