silverpheonix wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 4:05 pmSome IC information that doesn't rely on:
1) Someone eventually hitting the correct parameters and noticing; AND
2) Sharing that information IClyWould be amazing.
Heck, make it so PCs have a scaling chance to discover more detail about the ritual based off their Spellcraft and how many times they've performed it.
FOIG without any IG information on a mechanic kinda hurts things. When rituals first came out, I was expecting there to be books added in too that give hints or some general information on them.
Another example: Cometfall. I've done this ritual a number of times. Supposedly you should be able to bank the Comet for later use. I don't seem to be able to do this. Is it a bug? Is it because mystery mechanics haven't been met? Is it because I'm not seeing something simple or don't know there's a specific mechanical way to bank the Comet? Who knows! Do I waste staff time by submitting a bug report, forcing someone to dig into the code, and then tell me "it's working as intended"?
100% agreed. I mentioned this a few times, but FOIG when it exclusively requires other PCs sharing is not an intuitive or interesting solution.
For example, prior to the rework, the entire Dweomercrafting system has been broken down by players on an OOC level, with mechanical information shared freely through the wiki or Discord. The new system is seemingly even more transparent, with pretty obvious feedback being provided through the UI.
And are we really any worse off for it? I recall at a time when the wiki said that runes were supposed to be "FOIG" information. And yet, it is pretty clear as to how this system works now. And I really don't feel like any sort of value has been lost. Which really leads me into the overall question, which is: What is the intention for FOIG?
Is it meant to keep secrets? To create some element of mystery and intrigue? If so, I think it's a very poor solution for doing so for exactly the reasons highlighted above. The "mystery" component becomes all but irrelevant when there's nothing ingame to explain is this working as intended or not. How do I solve a mystery when the only clues provided just leads into a brute force solution? Just try every combination of events in every possible permutation, and eliminate what doesn't work over time, instead of actually solving it with presentable, identifying information.
And since it's FOIG, and possibly not well known, this just creates a very specific subset of users(aka the devs who wrote it), who know how this system actually works.
So the second option I can think is that it's to encourage roleplay. And this is fine, on paper. But presently, there still isn't enough detail provided ingame (from non player source) to reasonably go off and explore these systems. And when there is no lead in beyond, "just go ask something about it", this leads to frustrated players that feel like they're being gated by a system.
If we want to use an example of something where FOIG is good, we can take a look at sailing. The information on how to sail, what you need, and the mechanics behind doing so are explained both out of game, on the wiki, as well as ingame, with tutorials on boats. That means, in order to engage with sailing as content, you can just rent a boat, hop on, and go somewhere. And since you've lured in a player at their own pace, and let them intuitively discover the system, they're now more open to the idea of further mastery requiring the assistance of other players. Things like- Seagod rituals for boosts to sailing, pirates chests and maps, what islands are available to them, diving, ect.
And to bring this back to one of the original topics at hand, we have the introduction of Lanterns. Each provides a very vague description message. Now, without a developer telling me what these do, how exactly am I supposed to gleam the intended purpose?
How do I know that the description text isn't flavor text, and is actually a hint? I haven't received any feedback at all from the system. The angler's lantern improves catching speed time, similar to the Fisherman's waders. Well, if you're not paying attention really close, you probably won't even notice this.
Give us spellcraft checks, or lore checks. Give anything for players to go on, and it will generate a lot more collaborative roleplay overall, and generally be a lot more accessible for newer players. Which, I think is one of Arelith's strengths, and really it should be played into more.