[Edited] New Armours

[the grim yeeter]

Hi,

The Commanding Brigandine, for example, is way too powerful, for obvious reasons. Knights, most of all fiendguards, did not need this buff at all. Surely the armour must've been brought up in a discussion prior to implementation? How did it even make it through?

Edit: oh, apparently that armour is not the only one that's overtuned. Some of these armours really need to be revised.

That said, I'm really loving the Shaman items!

[Bunnysmack]

Oath of Wrath is one of Knight's least impressive abilities. The armor changes it to 50% up time instead of 33%. That's not really that OP. Other than that ability, the stats are good, but not obscene. If you want to compare really powerful class-locked armor variants, Chainmail of the Holy Paladin is still far and beyond way better.

It's also important to point out that Brigandine is half-plate, NOT full plate, meaning it has 1 less mundane AC than all of the new heavy armor recipes that just got launched.

ALSO EDIT: Ah, saw you revised your post. Well, if it's a critique of how most of the new armors are overtuned...Well, I'm half-inclined to agree with you. Still waiting to see how things pan out in play. To me, the definition of OP is still Chainmail of the Holy Paladin, and I don't see any of these coming close to that benchmark yet.

[a shrouded figure]

I’m way too thankful for the new hexblade chain. My AC was ABYSMAL. While it will still be trashy, this is a welcome welcome upgrade from masterly elven

[Irongron]

Polite feedback really is appreciated, especially after an update this large. Obviously these items were subject to lengthy discussion within the team, and later among patrons. I am sure, as with all items on Arelith some will go on to be further adjusted.

What I am really tired of seeing, is when people can't voice concerns without belittling the team that created them. It's just no way to behave towards staff. Remember that however strong your own opinion might be, it remains a subjective one.

[Bunnysmack]

Polite feedback really is appreciated, especially after an update this large. Obviously these items were subject to lengthy discussion within the team, and later among patrons. I am sure, as with all items on Arelith some will go on to be further adjusted.

What I am really tired of seeing, is when people can't voice concerns without belittling the team that created them. It's just no way to behave towards staff. Remember that however strong your own opinion might be, it remains a subjective one.

The work put into it is appreciated, and I apologize if my comment above came out otherwise. My mind tends to jump first to concerns about who will use XYZ things to abuse their fellow players in one-sided combat, and gear can often be a rather steep factor in allowing that (I know, not often a large concern, as consistently poor conduct in this regard actually isn't that common, and the people that go overboard usually get slapped by the DMs anyway).

Overall, however, I think these items were well created. Some might have some potential for...Problematic use, but It should give some much needed help to the more newly introduced classes, and if it is the start of everyone getting more shiny/customizable equipment options, that is a very exciting thing to see. The amount of work the team put into Arelith is never something I doubt, and it's been a VERY exciting year of new changes being added to the server.

[TroubledWaters]

I think the armors are a great way to bring some parity to the STR builds on the server. They don't look overtuned to me when you compare their wearers to their DEX melee counterparts.

[the grim yeeter]

Oath of Wrath is one of Knight's least impressive abilities.

Oath is actually a strong ability, with it being instant, giving -2 AC to a target, and a potential 15% vulnerability to any damage type (or +3 magical damage on the pdk vs. racial type).

If you want to compare really powerful class-locked armor variants, Chainmail of the Holy Paladin is still far and beyond way better.

Yes, and I've always said that armour needs a nerf, too.

It's also important to point out that Brigandine is half-plate, NOT full plate, meaning it has 1 less mundane AC than all of the new heavy armor recipes that just got launched.

On top of the usual adamantine full-plate a fiendguard would wear, that's +1 ac, +3 will, +4 leadership, +4 intimidate, -1 oath turn, Runic, and 5% bludgeoning immunity. That's a big buff.

[Bunnysmack]

Oath is a fairly well balanced ability, I'm not trying to say it is weak, cause it isn't, but among the things this armor COULD have reduced cooldown on, Oath is one of the least problematic ones.

If it had reduced CD on Rallying Cry, Fear, or Final Stand, THEN I would be pretty concerned, but Oath of Wrath has far less dramatic effects on a fight than any of those abilities.

[Nitro]

Wow, this is probably the first update I've seen that just gives me a direct feeling of power creep. This is just a straight up improvement to adamantine armour for the majority of classes, and even the ones that seem to be targeted not to receive the armours can jigger out a 45 point UMD tax without too much issue.

Also hello +5 lance.

[the grim yeeter]

Oath is a fairly well balanced ability, I'm not trying to say it is weak, cause it isn't, but among the things this armor COULD have reduced cooldown on, ...

What's the point in considering what could have been added? Yes, +8 AC would have been much worse than +4 AC, as well. I don't see why you would bring up which worse decisions could've been made.

... but Oath of Wrath has far less dramatic effects on a fight than any of those abilities.

Less dramatic, maybe (though, arguable), but definitely significant nonetheless. Just the -2 AC alone is already a huge debuff in plenty of cases.

[Svrtr]

In regards to complaints about these new heavy armors being better than addy plate armor, Ill leave this image here.


https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 42c835.png


Making such a complaint is redundant when you look at most every other unique non-generically named armor arelith has to be crafted. If heavy armor's new armors were weaker than addy plate or even nearly equal, then heavy armor would STILL be behind medium and light. They SHOULD be better to keep up with other armors.

And I think the team did a great job. Only thing Ill leave to say is that melven chain should be reduced to 5% slashing when you compare it to bulwark, and for the fact that elven chain having the same DI as heavy armor meant for earthkin defenders with the comparative descriptions, with elven chain having 1 less AC and no free 1 CON but being 40% weight, having +5 hide, and 3 times a day camoflauge and both being runic I think reducing the slashing DI on it to 5 may be beneficial and help with issues of barb DI who already has fantastic offensive capabilities and warlocks.

All in all though, great work and big shout out and thank you to Merry and Xerah

[Ork]

Comparatively, DEX bg/pdks receive more AC and near-equal damage as a STR bg/pdk. This does incentivize going STR, but I don't think it solves the AC disparity between the two builds. Overall, a great armor that I will be using :>

[AstralUniverse]

This basically raises most str builds ac by 1 and then some bonus to skills and maybe 5% more physical DI than before. Given that dex has been the ruling meta for a while, I dont really see how this update is a big problem.

[the grim yeeter]

Well, let's just see how it turns out eventually, then. I definitely get the idea behind them, bringing strength builds on par with dexterity builds and all, but I personally think a number of these armours could use nerfing, as it gives some builds too big of a boost.

[Ork]

I do agree that bg/pdk is a build to watch for. We have to be very conscious that buffing STR could tip this build over. It, truthfully, might be worth it to nerf this build by simply reducing the crit range of their highest tier summon.

[A MAN DRUNK ON POWER]

As a bard/pdk I love the new armor, all it's going to do is help me be an AC tank without panicking about maximizing my DEX as much with runic ranger leathers. My build does nothing for damage so this isn't really gamebreaking for me in any sense, just a neat little upgrade to my PvE usefulness.

I have zero idea about bg/pdk. I hate divine builds because they break most balancing. Divine shield/might should be capped at divine class levels. /rant

[Svrtr]

As a bard/pdk I love the new armor, all it's going to do is help me be an AC tank without panicking about maximizing my DEX as much with runic ranger leathers. My build does nothing for damage so this isn't really gamebreaking for me in any sense, just a neat little upgrade to my PvE usefulness.

I have zero idea about bg/pdk. I hate divine builds because they break most balancing. Divine shield/might should be capped at divine class levels. /rant

It is a deep BG build that gets epic fiend with PDK being there to buff the epic fiend.

Epic fiend is strong but good, and PDK makes it nicer. Not sure if increasing the uptime of OoW from 33% to 50% should be too much cause for concern, especially seeing as most non-PvE fights only last 3-6 rounds and not 20, but it isn't invalid.

And besides, it isn't about divine might or shield, as even then this build goes 16 levels into BG.

[Quidix]

I think the new armours look good and the team has done a great job!

Of course they are better than Adamantine Full Plate, that was the whole point of the update: to bring STR full plate closer to the very strong dex builds.

I don't see any issue with the knight armour, as for one it is a half-plate, so has less armour than all the other new additions (12 AC vs 13 AC).

Finally, getting 40-45 UMD is a substantial investment if the sole reason is to get one of these armours (and indeed Accursed Scales, which is very strong has 90 UMD).

[Griefmaker]

I am stoked to see all of these new items, especially for the classes that were lacking anything of their own.

This is great stuff. Thank you devs/dms and all!

[fading]

It's a fine update, diversity in gear is always appreciated, however.. Doesn't it make the adamantine full plate obsolete? I actually can't think of any build that would use it now, and I'm not sure that's a good thing?

[Haroshia]

The new Commander Brig makes me really happy, and you could fix the whole Fiendknight thing by just making it not allow divine shield while worn like the hexblade armor.

I have noticed a bug though. The crafting recipe for it appears to be the same as the Jousting Plate, which I doubt is intended.

[Svrtr]

It's a fine update, diversity in gear is always appreciated, however.. Doesn't it make the adamantine full plate obsolete? I actually can't think of any build that would use it now, and I'm not sure that's a good thing?

I do not mean to come off as condescending by posting this as a reply, but this is already true of most every unique armor. The best example is this following image.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... 42c835.png

[Good Character]

Always going to power creep, which is why it's walled behind much higher crafting DCs.

[Haroshia]

Always going to power creep, which is why it's walled behind much higher crafting DCs.

Power creep would be if it made already powerful things more powerful. I think a lot of this came from getting a high level look of some things that were lagging and introducing itemization to help them...at least I hope that's the intent.

It's very good.

[A MAN DRUNK ON POWER]

As a bard/pdk I love the new armor, all it's going to do is help me be an AC tank without panicking about maximizing my DEX as much with runic ranger leathers. My build does nothing for damage so this isn't really gamebreaking for me in any sense, just a neat little upgrade to my PvE usefulness.

I have zero idea about bg/pdk. I hate divine builds because they break most balancing. Divine shield/might should be capped at divine class levels. /rant

It is a deep BG build that gets epic fiend with PDK being there to buff the epic fiend.

Epic fiend is strong but good, and PDK makes it nicer. Not sure if increasing the uptime of OoW from 33% to 50% should be too much cause for concern, especially seeing as most non-PvE fights only last 3-6 rounds and not 20, but it isn't invalid.

And besides, it isn't about divine might or shield, as even then this build goes 16 levels into BG.

The more you know! Thanks