Bullywug Pod Queen (Skal)

[fading]

For reference, this is the boss of a writ levels 4-8.

AB in her 20s, damage in the 20s, frost shield, hammer of the gods DC 20, dispels. This isn't really a solo-able boss for melee characters as far as I can tell..? She's definitely too powerful for a boss you're supposed to be attempting at level 4, I can't imagine a party of beginners being able to defeat her.

It doesn't feel quite right either, the power difference between a typical bullywug enemy and her is incredible, compared to the xvart queen, jarl or satyr boss it feels like terrible balance. Just a bit ridiculous overall I suppose. I'd like to know if she's been buffed recently? I remember her being powerful but killable if prepared, maybe I just used to play better who knows lol

[AstralUniverse]

I have recently fought that queen on an overleveled character (about level 10-11 at the time). Someone was running for their lives and dragged the boss to the tin mine where I was mining obsidian innocently. I didnt even realize the pod queen looks like this now so I just buffed myself to the bones thinking "what the heck is this" and it was very very hard to take down, even with over leveled summons as a lvl 11 favoured soul.

So yeah, I guess I kind of agree it's too strong, although maybe the trick with this boss is to slay it before it gets a chance to buff up? Not sure really.

[fading]

I have recently fought that queen on an overleveled character (about level 10-11 at the time). Someone was running for their lives and dragged the boss to the tin mine where I was mining obsidian innocently. I didnt even realize the pod queen looks like this now so I just buffed myself to the bones thinking "what the heck is this" and it was very very hard to take down, even with over leveled summons as a lvl 11 favoured soul.

So yeah, I guess I kind of agree it's too strong, although maybe the trick with this boss is to slay it before it gets a chance to buff up? Not sure really.

That was my plan, but she immediately casted frost shield. So I had to focus on other mobs, while she started buffing and taking out large chunks of my hp. Mind you, I was playing 2hand hexblade so my AC was abyssmal, the plan was to just go in. Even with expertise I wouldn't be able to dodge any of her 20+ AB attacks. I vaguely remembered her having hold person, so I did use a clarity scroll, but hammer of the gods was what put the nail in the coffin.

I might try it again better prepared, dispels + darkness + displacement might work better, quite expensive though at this level in skal. I think she also casts ultravision on herself, not sure. Overall a very tough boss imo, especially at such low levels. I don't remember her being quite this bad, then again, she definitely didn't have frost shield before since that's relatively new, so I wonder if when adding that spell (which is already a buff over death armor) more changes were made, they seem quite unwarranted, she didn't need buffing. If any boss needs some small buff it'd be the jarl.

[Archnon]

No boss below level 8 for writ work should have frost shield. She must have been buffed recently. I remember being able to take her on but she definitely didn't pack that kind of punch.

perhaps just increase the writ level? Skal could use a few more mid-high level writs for the area.

[AstralUniverse]

perhaps just increase the writ level? Skal could use a few more mid-high level writs for the area.

That would make sense if the rest of the mobs in the area werent a lvl 4-6ish grind.

[LovelyLightningWitch]

No boss below level 8 for writ work should have frost shield. She must have been buffed recently. I remember being able to take her on but she definitely didn't pack that kind of punch.

perhaps just increase the writ level? Skal could use a few more mid-high level writs for the area.

I feel the same. I've been in Skal around january, and my swashbuckler with a wizard duo did just fine there. Wizard had conj focus though, maybe that gave us a boost due to basically getting a summon that's "kinda overlevelled"?

[fading]

Not one to just give up, I gave it another shot. 2 displacement scrolls and 30 healing kits later I manage to eek out a victory. Darkness seemed completely useless, dispels didn't do much, and almost died many times.

Her AC seems to be quite high too, I have 20 AB and could barely hit her most of the time. But I guess it's beatable? Not a good experience overall though.

[garrbear758]

This also applies to the one outside cordor

[Flower Power]

Yeah, the Bullywog Queen is kind of outrageous now.

Hand over fist more difficult than the Sea Bandits/Mound writs, and those had their levels pushed back to 'avoid people getting killed who weren't expecting the difficulty'.

[Irongron]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

[CNS]

The sea bandits boss has a similar difficulty spike compared to the rest of the dungeon.

SoV, that air elemental and a bunch of paralysis stuff and at least 1 maybe 2 full heals. And he spawns in with a strong premo.

The difference is at that level you can assume Pcs have abilities and consumables to be able to handle it. Before that sort of range it's a bit harsh to expect Pcs to be able to prepare themselves as well.

I get where Iron is coming from, but especially on the lower end of content you'll always have some folks who know the system inside out and will cake walk it, make it challenging for those folks and you make it miserable for the rest.

The other issue is, especially at lower level dnd can be very all or nothing, it's rare to have a solid nailbiting fight. What you usually get is side A destroys side B, either because numbers were off or because of a few lucky rolls. The line between I stomp you and you stomp is very thin.

[Flower Power]

The difference is at that level you can assume Pcs have abilities and consumables to be able to handle it. Before that sort of range it's a bit harsh to expect Pcs to be able to prepare themselves as well.

That boss is also sequestered behind a locked door and doesn't need to be killed to complete the writ, as well.

The Bullywog Pod Queen must be killed (if I remember the writ properly) - and at that level, with the AB ranges you're looking at, you need direct damage to do it (or a LOT of lucky 20's and probably your resurrection godsave, which is how I managed it with a VERY well-tuned melee build.) Since it's got something in the ballpark of 70-100 HP, no L5 wizard is going to be packing enough direct damage spells to deal with it.

The sad truth of it is, when you apply a sudden and arbitrary difficulty spike to the boss of an area, you aren't actually making the content more interesting - you're just making an experience (i.e. a probable trip to the Fugue Plane) that ranges from unpleasant to lukewarm at best for 90% of the players who weren't expecting to be suddenly stomped on, and marking off the dungeon as yet another one not worth visiting for the players who do know about it.

[Aren]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

We were two 34+ AC, 18-21 ab characters, level 8 and 7, one guarding the other. The pod queen tore through our defenses, and it took 2 godsaves and 40+ healkits to actually kill it. I would say that it is likely a tad overtuned

[Babylon System is the Vampire]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

When you say "I really dislike seeing them as pushovers" what do you mean? The reason I am confused is because sometimes it sounds like you want it so it takes a team to beat these guys, and sometimes it sounds like you want people to be able to solo, both based on your own words. The truth is that if you want people to be able to solo with strategy eventually everyone will know said strategy and it will become a pushover again. If you want it to require a team you need to think in terms of what else you can put in there with it to sure up its weaknesses. For example, if its a caster boss maybe two damage dealers in the mob around it. If its a bruiser, some casters. Some people will still figure out how to solo it, but they are a small minority of players with skill and a set on them. And if you try and make it too hard for them you will likely wipe out groups in droves as a result among everyone else.

Also, you definitely need to revisit the queen. Not only is she way too strong if you enter the room, she is too big for the door letting you totally cheese it from the pathway in.

[fading]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

Glad this will be looked into then! I was more worried about newer players and their experience, a relatively well geared and warded group of new players should be able to have an enjoyable dungeon experience appropriate to their level, and for their adventure to be completely destroyed right at the end would suck a lot. I personally don't think it's reasonable to expect a need for displacement scrolls on low level writs, because that's the only way I was able to do it.

[Good Character]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

I agree with the sentiment. What of removing the mandatory requirement for killing certain bosses and instead make it optional in return for more XP/gold upon writ completion? Could do this for near every writ, too. It would still allow solo play but highly encourage group play.

[Kenji]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

I quite like the design of some starter area writs such as:
Cordor Archives
Founder's Cave
Help Wrynn Out

Where these don't require the players to take out the area boss, but the writs can still be completed by just having enough kills around the area.

If we make the bosses optional, there's less of a concern to make them more powerful without impeding the more casual players from their progress.

There's also a pirate writ that focuses on taking out the "bosses" for the explorable islands, maybe we can design some new writs where it checks off bosses from different areas for slightly higher reward than the usual farming writs.

[Morgy]

I'll revisit this. I saw level 6 characters routinely steamrolling the old version so likely boosted it a little too far...

Though of course bosses should be challenging and require tactics, I really dislike seeing them as pushovers, which many still are.

I quite like the design of some starter area writs such as:
Cordor Archives
Founder's Cave
Help Wrynn Out

Where these don't require the players to take out the area boss, but the writs can still be completed by just having enough kills around the area.

If we make the bosses optional, there's less of a concern to make them more powerful without impeding the more casual players from their progress.

There's also a pirate writ that focuses on taking out the "bosses" for the explorable islands, maybe we can design some new writs where it checks off bosses from different areas for slightly higher reward than the usual farming writs.

Gathering Tribes in Skal is great too because there’s a lot of fighting but you don’t have any bosses you need to slay to pass the writ. Love that writ.

[MRFTW]

Gathering Tribes in Skal is great too because there’s a lot of fighting but you don’t have any bosses you need to slay to pass the writ. Love that writ.

My favourite writ.

Good enemy variety and the areas make for different types of terrain for blocking and such. The one boss in there is interestingly designed and a good challenge, and also easily avoided with a single invis potion while still being able to finish the writ.

[Good Character]

I decided to give this boss a go with another. My character is level 9 (so one beyond the recommended 4-8 range) and fully-geared. Dragged someone along thinking two people could likely manage it. Man did we get smashed. It is bittersweet, because it's nice to see a difficult boss at an early level. However, it feels futile to do this writ at the suggested range without a full party.

[Wethrinea]

I have conflicting feelings on this one. I recently tried my hand at a feylock, and teamed up with a monk and a fighter to do the Bullywugs. The Pod queen made for an intense fight, where my feylock -just- managed to kill it after the two other party members fell, so from a writ perspective it was a failure.

But man did it make for a great RP experience. Sometimes being smacked down and forced to make decisions (do I pull out my pact summon to save the others?) is what makes adventuring interesting.

So yeah, the Pod Queen is completely out of tune compared to the level range. But the surprise and ferocity of it also makes it an interesting writ.

[Ork]

Yeah, probably dropping this quest.

[malcolm_mountainslayer]

It also has a good caster lvl which makes ir tuen undead/dispel quite effectively while destroying your attempts to dispel for "tactics"

[fading]

Didn't know this server was full of OMEGAS and GAMMAS. Pathetic! Go on, give it another try, I beat it. You might be able to become a superior beta like myself