New writ "system"

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Archnon
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Archnon » Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:08 pm

The place I see losing players because of this might be skal due to write limits. Ut I haven't tried. Overall I was skeptical but like zavandar said I'm pretty impressed so far.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by SkipiusEsq » Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:54 pm

I am personally not happy with the changes. I am VERY casual in that I only have an hour here and there I can play. As a result, I tend to take writs that I can (1) complete on my own and (2) complete quickly. That means takings the writs that are close to where I am that have less overall things to do, while also involving creatures I believe I can defeat. While it is nice to get an XP boost for that FIRST writ, I am now forced to take writs that require more time to complete. I also don't know all of the maps, which means time to explore. If that's the goal, I get it.

Ultimately, this change has made me want to play less.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Curve » Sun Sep 12, 2021 2:39 pm

Seems very hard to make the writ system account for people who play 12+ hours a day and people who play for one hour here and there.

Players sometimes expect too much. I understand the frustration of having limited time to play and level your character, but if all you have is an hour here and there it makes sense to me that you progress slowly, or that you maybe only have time to do one writ sometimes rather than all three every day. The rewards have been adjusted to account for this, it seems.

I am kind of blown away that the DEVs had the nerve to change the writ system, as it has always seemed to be a Pandora’s box to me. The change feels like a positive one and I think people will come to accept that with more exposure.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by SkipiusEsq » Sun Sep 12, 2021 4:30 pm

Curve wrote:
Sun Sep 12, 2021 2:39 pm
Players sometimes expect too much. I understand the frustration of having limited time to play and level your character, but if all you have is an hour here and there it makes sense to me that you progress slowly, or that you maybe only have time to do one writ sometimes rather than all three every day. The rewards have been adjusted to account for this, it seems.
So basically, if you already played a whole bunch every day, did your three writs and then grinded, you are not really negatively impacted by the change and, in fact, get an XP boost. But, if you only play a small amount every day, welp, too bad so sad, now you get even less every day.

a shrouded figure
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by a shrouded figure » Sun Sep 12, 2021 4:40 pm

I think the point is- now you can spend your hour a day /roleplaying/ instead of feeling like you need to get your three writs done and log off.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Curve » Sun Sep 12, 2021 5:02 pm

SkipiusEsq wrote: So basically, if you already played a whole bunch every day, did your three writs and then grinded, you are not really negatively impacted by the change and, in fact, get an XP boost. But, if you only play a small amount every day, welp, too bad so sad, now you get even less every day.
I wonder if you would elaborate on what kind of time/reward ratio you think is best. If I play one hour a day and you play ten should you expect ten times as much xp and gold if we put the same amount of effort into it? Or should there be a base level of reward that everyone can expect and those that go beyond that get extra? Or should it be all get the same reward per day no matter what? I am legitimately interested.

Aside from that I think if you give the system a try you will find that you will get similar if not more reward for the same amount of time. Seriously, give it a try and report back in a couple days if you see the expected xp drop significantly.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Kuma » Sun Sep 12, 2021 6:34 pm

SkipiusEsq wrote:
Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:54 pm
I am personally not happy with the changes. I am VERY casual in that I only have an hour here and there I can play.
This may sound harsh but perhaps this isn't the server for you then. Or you need to re-evalulate the sort of style of roleplay you want.

Don't get me wrong I'm the first to say that neets that have 16+ hours a day aren't who we should be catering the server to, but like. An hour here and there is unfortunately not something that can or should be balanced around in a PW setting when it is the stark minority.

Anyway, thankfully this isn't a problem! Since you now just have to do different rewards to get an objectively higher XP boost than you were before. Unless you liked hopping on for an hour at a time to stare at the same three screens of dungeon?

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Kenji » Sun Sep 12, 2021 7:28 pm

SkipiusEsq wrote:
Sun Sep 12, 2021 4:30 pm
Curve wrote:
Sun Sep 12, 2021 2:39 pm
Players sometimes expect too much. I understand the frustration of having limited time to play and level your character, but if all you have is an hour here and there it makes sense to me that you progress slowly, or that you maybe only have time to do one writ sometimes rather than all three every day. The rewards have been adjusted to account for this, it seems.
So basically, if you already played a whole bunch every day, did your three writs and then grinded, you are not really negatively impacted by the change and, in fact, get an XP boost. But, if you only play a small amount every day, welp, too bad so sad, now you get even less every day.
My experience is quite the opposite. I play about 1 hour a day and 4 days a week on 1 character, just about enough for just about 1 writ, solo or grouped. My recent experience is my character now levels at an even faster rate because of the frontload xp boost.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Quidix » Sun Sep 12, 2021 8:16 pm

I really like the new system. More variety and feels nice getting more xp while RP'ing.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by ZeroPointEnergy » Sun Sep 12, 2021 8:47 pm

Levelings a lot faster and I'm actually out of adventure RP from RPing before 30 for once. My only complaint is I don't like change and learning unused dungeons but whatever, the exp makes it worth it.

a shrouded figure
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by a shrouded figure » Sun Sep 12, 2021 9:13 pm

I’m liking the change. Leveling is feeling really quick and light. Already feeling less pressure to grind every second I’m logged in.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Chosen Son » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:03 am

Really like the new system. Radically lessens the need to grind. Like it even more as someone that plays casually and no longer needs to pick between XP or rp.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Watchful Glare » Mon Sep 13, 2021 7:43 am

The new system is great. I would recommend ramping up the rewards for the already completed writs. If you're aiming for passive XP via adventure XP while you just lounge about and RP, the adventure XP of a writ is consumed rather fast. Overall, really liking these changes.
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Maladus
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Maladus » Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:28 pm

I think the changes are pretty great. At first the change seemed like it was going to be bad, but the writ change coupled with the increase in passive XP gain from the RP makes this feel like a move in the right direction. For the first time ever I'm worried about running out of Adventure XP (which isn't a bad thing). If anything at all needs tweaking it would be that a slight increase in adventure XP gained the first time you complete a writ, but other than that this is a great update.

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Zavandar
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Zavandar » Mon Sep 13, 2021 5:19 pm

Update:

So as I said prior I got to 4k from 16 before the writ changes went into effect. Last night I hit 21. Unless I am getting a new batch of writs, it seems like I'll have no more available in anduor and must only have shadovar left. I'm sure I wouldn't have run into this problem if the character had been made after the update instead of prior

I do have a question though. I think something to help fill in gaps in writs (maybe one you don't think you can solo, etc) would be courier writs. Maybe some lowbie ones that don't take you far from Andunor, and maybe some other ones that take you to saltspar, the outpost, and maybe even back again.
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Maladus
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Maladus » Mon Sep 13, 2021 9:38 pm

The only character I've played since this update is level 13 now, so I don't know how this will pan out into later levels. Perhaps the epic writs and only the epic writs can have a cooldown placed on them. Make it something long, like two or three weeks and after that period is up you can run them again to get the reward in up front XP.

Zanithar
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Zanithar » Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:53 am

My general feedback is I like the change. My constructive feedback is specifically relative to balance.

It looks like the surface benefits disproportionally from this change. I must admit this is my "feeling" as I have never done a count of writs (I have never needed to prior to this change). I suspect the surface must have twice the number of writs the Underdark does and likely a factor of 10 larger than Skal (granted Skal is not meant for more than early to mid teens but low level writs on the surface are still a larger number).

Now, I personally love starting on Skal, it is a harder start but that is a tax I am willing to pay for a more Chaotic starting area. Although I really do like Skal I also understand people are pretty polarized about Skal and I would ask this does not turn into a Skal is bad vs. good and anything that makes it harder is good thread please. This change has doubled down on the difficulty and I am not sure that is/should be the goal here. If the goal / secondary goal is to get people to do the writs there and motivate them to move on to the surface, then it probably is fit for purpose.

It also will have a secondary impact for visibly evil characters on the surface I suspect. It will be harder to go to "out of the common path" areas and writ focus there. For two reasons: one you will run out of them and be motiviated to head back into more civilized areas; two the folks in more civilized areas will be motivated to head to the less common areas. Not necessarily a bad thing in my opinion but will create more conflict I suspect.

It would be nice to see this managed/balanced across the various segregated starting areas in some fashion (assuming it has not be accounted for in the design approach here).

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Gee look who
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Gee look who » Fri Sep 17, 2021 4:26 pm

I'm not personally against it...

I just feel it makes people who can't play as much earn even less xp per day, since they don't have time to explore.
It is great for new players to see more of the game. But not as much for players like myself that might already have done all or almost all writs.

Overral, I think xp per tick was better at 120 flat then it is now... at low level getting 20+40 for 40 rpr, and not getting direct xp for every writ, made my character level much slower. I did became very rich though. On epics it is great.

to balance it out, I think we need more xp per tick at low levels. And maybe a little direct xp for repeated writs would be great.

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Gee look who
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Gee look who » Fri Sep 17, 2021 4:32 pm

Zanithar wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:53 am
(...)It also will have a secondary impact for visibly evil characters on the surface I suspect. It will be harder to go to "out of the common path" areas and writ focus there. For two reasons: one you will run out of them and be motiviated to head back into more civilized areas; two the folks in more civilized areas will be motivated to head to the less common areas. Not necessarily a bad thing in my opinion but will create more conflict I suspect.(...)
I raised this point before. But on that note, there could be secret writs for evil characters in the surface. That would be a great way to balance this, while creating more content. (Including evil characters from UD, Cordor, Skal and Sencliff).

(I was shocked that Svirfs that start in brog can't do writs in cordor :D)

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by AlonelyBard » Sat Sep 18, 2021 9:06 pm

I feel like something that's not really brought up but should be, Releveling
If for whatever reason you're going for a delevel,(Because who knows how long we'll be able to rebuild on command like this) you're at a massive disadvantage, less and less writs are able to be taken for the XP bonus.
Outside of that, I'm not a massive fan of the change, quite a few of the writs are poorly balanced. A Martial character will heavily struggle with a writ, while a caster will breeze through them all, just like before. Just now, most martials will have to work on less and less appealing writs for them.
With the cash nerf on writs, Martial builds are spending a large percentage of their income on potions and scrolls, (Barkskin, Mage Armor, Shield, zoo buffs, Haste, GMW, Bless Weapon) while still having a heavy tax on their skill points through Discipline, Craft Mastery if they want to dwemor, saving for a tumble dump, lore and you're already at most martial's skill point limit.
A lot of writs out there were chosen because they're easier than others, yes, but remember that there are plenty of classes out there that can't beat a DC20 will save at level 8(Or be taken out of a fight for whole minutes at a time), that can't open lock/Disable trap for additional money, likely no leadership as well.
My point here is that while some are flying through these writs with little effort, please understand that if we're trying to bring a more RP focused way of doing things (Grouping up, conversing with others while we do writs, or even just being able to clear writs quickly to get the XP Dripfeed) please make it so that builds don't straight up get left behind for doing so.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by a shrouded figure » Sat Sep 18, 2021 10:57 pm

I’ll comment that with the recent reductions (granted they were probably warranted), I’ve noticed that I am tempted to grind more again. On the plus side, I really want making much gold standing around anundor hahaha

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by TheFox » Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:42 am

I am and have always been the sort of player who tries to get involved with other people and factions early. I am saying this so that people know where I am coming from. I get bored with questing/grinding very easily sometimes and I'm one of those people who more or less ignores it after a certain point and rides the rest of the way on adventure xp.

I recently made a melee character. Initially I had trouble finding other people to do writs with, but they exist. So far, the impetus to try new writs has been nice. I'm familiar with most of the low range surface writs but I also used to grind mid levels.

Up front XP is nice. The increased RPR tick has been pretty boss too. I have maybe redone one or two quests when I have run into people who need them done and I find the creature xp+adventure xp still gets me my levels. It's taken me two, maybe three days to hit level ten. As I said - not the fastest leveler.

I think I'm probably the sort of player who benefits most from these changes. RP at lower levels, quest to meet people and get gold, try to build up relationships with repeat parties. Eventually conquer the world or something.

With the new system I find myself very fluidly proceeding through one writ at a time as I do RP and it's been faster than I remember it being.

I've never really thought it was wise to do writs alone. Personally I hate dying in this game to NPCs. So, I will wait around or go find people to run with.

In that sense this change has been great for me personally since it supports my personal playstyle. Yay.

Now, having said all that, the following might ruffle some feathers - just bear in mind my playstyle.

People have mentioned the system being disadvantageous to evil characters like warlocks and necromancers. But, I think that is low-key intended. Player governments have the power to exile and pariah people. Would you really want to be playing an evil character if nobody cares?

I've played good and evil both, in my time here, and there are usually bad actors on both sides of the fence when it comes to how players handle conflict. So I get the necessity of getting 30 as quickly as possible for simple survival's sake.

But, I have also seen a lot of toleration and ooc courtesy extended from the better packs of RPers. Just keeping a good attitude and giving the benefit of the doubt goes a long way towards making all that more enjoyable.

So I just wanted to say give it a try and see where it goes. I always try to deal with bad actors on a case by case basis and not assume things because each situation is usually different.

I get that having some restrictions isn't fun. Still, playing the bad guys is kind of a hard mode choice too, and I actually think that the necessity of coming into more populated areas as a lower or mid level baddie is beneficial to said baddie in the long run in terms of story and brand recognition. Running into someone with your undead out doing a quest is much lower stakes narratively than jumping someone as a top geared top level baddie nobody's had the chance to see as a character.

It's the same with playing a paladin or a Harper in some place like Andunor - I've done both - and it comes with implied social restrictions. That's part of the fun. If you're caught you're done for. Dodging and weaving and lying and being careful are part of the fun of that sort of concept. Figuring out a way to go on or finding allies is absolutely necessary. Plus, nobody lives forever. At least, nobody interesting does.

So - feature, rather than flaw, is my reasoning.

Ultimately I think the system is working as intended. Makes my life easier anyway, makes it so I don't have to checkmark the three quests a day, let's me go scheme and not feel like I'm missing out.

As a suggestion, I do agree with maybe providing direct XP for repeat quests, even if it's just a fraction of the adventure xp and the total remains the same. Something doesn't feel quite right about it to me just now. But I do agree with making repeat quests less rewarding - just not unrewarding.
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xanrael
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Re: New writ "system"

Post by xanrael » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:35 pm

-If below level 10, writ reward xp is capped to 250 * character level.
Not really a fan of this extent of cap. Maybe lots of people love redoing 3-9 for the nth time though.

Are the writ rewards still based on their recommended level at level 10+? Just curious if for example people would avoid doing any writs till level 10 then proceed to run about the Bonefields and Sewers once they ran out of easy writs to do in their recommended level range.

Will be curious to see if the removal of the party level cap will actually encourage merc company roleplay to be a thing for non-PvP purposes.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Ork » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:41 pm

LETS GO!

I love this change. I would love it more if writs were reduced in number per day, but I think this is a healthy alternative to doing the kuo-toan writ for the 60th time.

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Re: New writ "system"

Post by Drowboy » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:51 pm

What if, after getting a character to 21 for the first time, anyone with a 20 or higher can start chars at like, 7-10. Somewhere in there.
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