Arelith

It would be nice to see fewer bosses with phylacteries.

When you meet the first one it is kinda neat, and if the opponent is a lich, it makes sense, but over time it feels like EVERYBODY has a phylactery. I'm kinda surprised treasure rat hasn't gotten one at this point.

I must add, can we remove the damage reduction pls? Dex builds find it really hard, last time my rogue and a dex ranger in Cordor crypt, we burned out all healing supplies so that my temp essence can deal 3 damage to it per round! Took us forever to kill and almost died.

xf1313 wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:00 pm

I must add, can we remove the damage reduction pls? Dex builds find it really hard, last time my rogue and a dex ranger in Cordor crypt, we burned out all healing supplies so that my temp essence can deal 3 damage to it per round! Took us forever to kill and almost died.

There are strategies for dealing with this, basically it is possible to solo the cordor crypt boss with a single thief.

However those strategies aren't a whole lot of fun and take a ton of time.

There is one which doesn't take a ton of time but is very expensive, both in consumables and investing in specific skill (which, to be fair, most rogues/characters do anyway). Not sure how FOIG it is though, so won't mention it myself fully but many more veteran characters should know it if asked ingame.

ltlukoziuz wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:30 pm

There is one which doesn't take a ton of time but is very expensive, both in consumables and investing in specific skill (which, to be fair, most rogues/characters do anyway). Not sure how FOIG it is though, so won't mention it myself fully but many more veteran characters should know it if asked ingame.

Regarding crypt boss I wish there was some sort of alternative reward for pickpocketing the bastard without getting caught. Or a quest for that. But that's a different topic entirely.

Yeah, I don't think writ company would be too happy about not destroying an undead threat (let's ignore the fact it keeps returning), so that's another topic completely. But the thing I meant kills phylactery really quickly, and after that just have to deal with enemies themselves.

I think it's best to leave phylacteries as they are. They provide an opportunity for coordination and planning that can be really fun.

If your dexterity based character can't even damage the thing I don't consider that unfair or a balance issue, characters have weaknesses.

I loath them with a passion but the writs almost always explicitly warn you so find a bulky strength friend or two to go with you when you run that writ.

I'd leave them, though I do really hate them on a personal level.

My opinion is that character should have weaknesses. That weakness should -never- be "cannot finish content". That's a sign of uninspired mechanics.

They really should be renamed to something else, life beacon or something, I don't know. But only actual liches should have a Phylactery.

We can probably look at the hard counter to these phylacteries: Destruction spell from the cleric spellbook.

There exist these "Wyrd Stones" with those spells on them. We can potentially give art crafting some new recipes to craft these stones via an amount of granite, marble, and destruction scrolls.

These items can then be sold at, hopefully, a reasonable price to adventurers.

Some phylacteries (dependent on the dungeon level range) should be reviewed for the required HP to knock them down too.

I'll have to review their numbers.

Spyre wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:27 am

Some phylacteries (dependent on the dungeon level range) should be reviewed for the required HP to knock them down too.

I'll have to review their numbers.

Of all low level dungeons with phylacteries, the Cordor Crypts are the worst, specially for beginners. Too much hp, too few tools to deal with it.

xf1313 wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:00 pm

I must add, can we remove the damage reduction pls? Dex builds find it really hard, last time my rogue and a dex ranger in Cordor crypt, we burned out all healing supplies so that my temp essence can deal 3 damage to it per round! Took us forever to kill and almost died.

its not supposed to be an easy fight, even dex builds can take a bulls potion or scroll with them

On top of my head, the Phylacteries of the Cordor Crypt and the Troglodyte lair in Skal have way, waaay too much hp for the amount of damage characters deal in these levels, while we're at it.

Also,

Kenji wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:30 am

There exist these "Wyrd Stones" with those spells on them. We can potentially give art crafting some new recipes to craft these stones via an amount of granite, marble, and destruction scrolls.

These items can then be sold at, hopefully, a reasonable price to adventurers.

This is an excellent idea, if giving people Destruction with no umd/lore is a good idea (at least I dont see anything destructive in it, pun unintended). More craftables. There are literally 10-12 items in the entire Art menu that I would sell in a shop rn. More would be nice.

Kenji wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:30 am

We can probably look at the hard counter to these phylacteries: Destruction spell from the cleric spellbook.

There exist these "Wyrd Stones" with those spells on them. We

That's 7th level spell for a 7-10 level dungeon.

I'd rather not see something like that. Wyrd stone has 10k shop price, and using very expensive consumables is not reall a way to finish a relatively low level writ.

Spyre wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:27 am

Some phylacteries (dependent on the dungeon level range) should be reviewed for the required HP to knock them down too.

I'll have to review their numbers.

I think they also have varying amount of DR. While the weakest one is something like 5/- or 6/-, I think they go much higher than that, at which point a non-strength character will have very hard time destroying one (as dexers employ death by a thousand cuts tactic or sneak attack).

The main problem is that this mechanic is not exactly fun and feels like it is overused. There are 2 npcs for which phylactery is justified by lore reason ("Master" and Manfred) and one more that MAYBE has a reason of having one (Morghunn). The rest feel out of place. I think there are 7-10 bosses with a phylactery at the moment, maybe more.

I feel like phylacteries being a bit of trouble for dexers, is just similar to locks etc being problematic for STR characters. It motivates people to either group up, or solve it solo in non-efficient way.

Ebonstar wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:24 am

xf1313 wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:00 pm

I must add, can we remove the damage reduction pls? Dex builds find it really hard, last time my rogue and a dex ranger in Cordor crypt, we burned out all healing supplies so that my temp essence can deal 3 damage to it per round! Took us forever to kill and almost died.

its not supposed to be an easy fight, even dex builds can take a bulls potion or scroll with them

What can I say, both of us were playing dex build on this server for the first time, and even with bull’s potion My character cannot damage it. Immediately understand why so many play str melee. Tons of damage and can carry much more on their back.

mourisson1 wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:15 am

I feel like phylacteries being a bit of trouble for dexers, is just similar to locks etc being problematic for STR characters. It motivates people to either group up, or solve it solo in non-efficient way.

+1

phylacetrys for the bosses are one of the few things that make the more challenging dungeons to solo challenging to solo. There are probably better ways to deal with that, but each and every idea I can think of will lead to more deaths than the phylacteries do, since they mostly involve boosting the boss fights or the mobs in general.

mourisson1 wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:15 am

It motivates people to either group up, or solve it solo in non-efficient way.

In majority of writs there's no mention of a phylactery even when the boss has one. So you discover that thing when you reach the boss. If you're a dexer, you'll be royally screwed.

Party is nice and all, but for example in majority of time I end up travelling alone, and partying is an uncommon occurence rather than norm.

I've found yet another phylactery boss yesterday, by the way. Would be real nice to have fewer of those, as it feels like the mechanic is simply slapped onto anything that is a boss, and not used for a lore reason.

For me it's not a challenge issue, it is an immersion one. Like they have stupid amounts of hp. Death spells thst work on objects auto destroy them evem though there not living but a barbarian rage crit just cracks it instead of instantly into pieces.

Easy fix. Make them one shotted and just put them behind a bashable locked door. If sneak is stealthy enough to sneak past then they can pick the lock and smash them. Meanwhile strength people can still bash the door down during combat and one shot it after.

Not sure what a dexer without lockpick would do in this case though...hmm.

MageTankTech wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:54 pm

Easy fix. Make them one shotted and just put them behind a bashable locked door. If sneak is stealthy enough to sneak past then they can pick the lock and smash them. Meanwhile strength people can still bash the door down during combat and one shot it after.

Not sure what a dexer without lockpick would do in this case though...hmm.

I like this solution (1 rank crossclass is all thats needed) I still don't like that death spells destroy objects in nwn

Kenji wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:30 am

We can probably look at the hard counter to these phylacteries: Destruction spell from the cleric spellbook.

There exist these "Wyrd Stones" with those spells on them. We can potentially give art crafting some new recipes to craft these stones via an amount of granite, marble, and destruction scrolls.

These items can then be sold at, hopefully, a reasonable price to adventurers.

Magitech manuals also exist.