meme posting

[great balls of fire]

This one's for the community.

When your PC is hanging out in a public social hub (like a town square, a tavern, a busy thoroughfare) your RP might be somebody's first impression of your character, or might be one of the very few impressions they'll ever get of your PC. So, take a little time to think about your RP in these spaces and consider if it's conducive to the way you want people to treat your RP and regard your character.

There's no nice way to put this, so I'll be blunt. The level of modern language, meme references, and goofiness in general, has gone from occasional subversion of convention to constant and frequent practice.

It's difficult to report this kind of behavior, or even point out any specific persons guilty of it, because it is so prevalent, so normalized, it's just everywhere. And, its also some times a matter of delivery, tone, and character portrayal. However, it will benefit to give some examples.

"Yikes," "Wife Material," "lives in head rent-free," "I am [god's] strongest [meme]," "Dripped out," "I'm just silly lil guy," and so on.

I'm sure you're seeing what I'm putting down here.

There's nothing wrong with using some modern language like "Hey" or when it's slang that portrays the character as uncultured/young/streetwise/etc, like "what's good." I'm even cool with goof troop hours when it's just the gang hanging out in their private/not as often traveled spaces.

For me, the problem is that I've found my first encounter with a lot of characters these days is during the goofin' hours in public hubs (like town squares, taverns) or public events. Sometimes it can be quite a whiplash to read a character description that reflects a really carefully considered character and history, and then you find them using some really strange behavior that doesn't seem to correlate to the character.

So, again. I'm not here to call anyone out or tell anyone how to RP or deliver some essay on how to write good. I'm just here to give some feedback on the vibe and remind folks that sometimes your goof troop hours might be somebody's first encounter with your PC. Maybe think a little more on if the impression you're giving off is necessarily the one you want for your character.

do with that what you will.

[DM Monkey]

I agree! This sort of thing can really detract from the setting. Ultimately this sort of thing gets considered when we review RPR of players.

Memes and jokes are fun amongst friends, no one is going to try and shut down your fun stuff. Just keep the OOC jokes OOC and the IC stuff more setting appropriate and you’re in the clear.

[In Sorrow We Trust]

make up your own slang that fits the character and setting

that's more fun and interesting anyway

[D4wN]

I also strongly agree with this. I even got annoyed every time someone started their sentence with "I mean.." Which is a current popular phrasing to start all your sentences with. When someone begins every other sentence with that it's really annoying. The typical modern slang and phrases and people memeing is also really immersion breaking and something that has bothered me a long time. I absolutely do not mind people joking and being funny etc. It's just the modern slang and phrasing that can get to me.

[In Sorrow We Trust]

I also strongly agree with this. I even got annoyed every time someone started their sentence with "I mean.." Which is a current popular phrasing to start all your sentences with. When someone begins every other sentence with that it's really annoying. The typical modern slang and phrases and people memeing is also really immersion breaking and something that has bothered me a long time. I absolutely do not mind people joking and being funny etc. It's just the modern slang and phrasing that can get to me.

yes, but here's the issue; the DnD setting was founded on modern English and many of the books use some modern English structuring

it's hard to know how people talked in the old times. I used to think "yo" was inappropriate until I learned that it was used in 1100s. there's a difference between relatable language.

if we wanted to be period accurate to the approximate equivalent, no one would understand what you were saying unless they had a degree in English history, and no one would be using languages outside of English either in game, we would have proper dictionaries

[Bazelgeuse]

oh boy, another thing to set off the constant anxiety that everyone's scrutinizing and judging me and hunting for reasons to snub me

[D4wN]

oh boy, another thing to set off the constant anxiety that everyone's scrutinizing and judging me and hunting for reasons to snub me

I wouldn't see it like that. I don't think I have ever seen you do that. And let me say too that I don't mind it when it happens on occasion. But when you constantly have to listen to modern phrasing and memeing it gets old real fast. Being a bit goofy and silly amongst friends is fine imo.

[In Sorrow We Trust]

oh boy, another thing to set off the constant anxiety that everyone's scrutinizing and judging me and hunting for reasons to snub me

you're fine. if people were really serious about it, you would be lynched for saying things like "okay", too. that's a more modern term than a lot of other things

[Xarge VI]

Personally I don't think we should expect people to be able to avoid modern phrasings. Most of us aren't literature experts with the faculties to even detect modern phrasings on the fly or use correct old timey ones.

But blatant memeing is very obvious when it happens and it goes hand in hand with other symptoms of basic MMORPG mindset bleeding into character interactions. I find it disturbing as well.

[D4wN]

oh boy, another thing to set off the constant anxiety that everyone's scrutinizing and judging me and hunting for reasons to snub me

you're fine. if people were really serious about it, you would be lynched for saying things like "okay", too. that's a more modern term than a lot of other things

Sure, and it's not stuff like that I would get upset about. It's more for example being called a simp (ICly, yes this happened) or having people use the more obvious modern slang. Like if someone would say 'yolo' or 'drip' etc.

[Amateur Hour]

Certified Old Person moment: I honestly don't catch most memeing unless it's, as the original post stated, memeing where your character's personality and traits are radically shifting away from normal for the purpose of delivering the meme. I wouldn't bat an eye at an overconfident paladin of Lathander calling himself "Lathander's strongest warrior" because that probably makes complete sense in-character. Subtlety is an art.

yes, but here's the issue; the DnD setting was founded on modern English and many of the books use some modern English structuring

it's hard to know how people talked in the old times. I used to think "yo" was inappropriate until I learned that it was used in 1100s. there's a difference between relatable language.

In addition to the Tiffany Effect here, there's also the fact that some words that are very modern don't sound modern to our ear. "Hurry" has been in use for less than 200 years; we should all be saying "make haste" instead, but no one throws fits when someone uses the word "hurry." This is a problem that comes up for reenactors all the time, but they typically have much stricter guidelines than we should have for a fantasy setting.

[Kuma]

I think there is a clear and obvious difference between "technically, we should all be speaking in 'period accurate English' (despite it not being a period setting) [nerd face emoji]" and seeing someone say "rizz" or "rent-free" in game.

[Dr. B]

I think there's a balance to be struck here. While the Forgotten Realms are a setting, they're a setting defined by the medium it was created for: a game for people who speak modern languages to drop some of their inhibitions and engage in fun, often silly improv. Dungeons and Dragons: Honor Among Thieves, which is canon, was fully aware of this and leaned into it very heavily. If someone is using language that presupposes knowledge of cars, internet, social media, that's annoying and out of character. Otherwise, I really don't care.

[Kuma]

I think there's a balance to be struck here. While the Forgotten Realms are a setting, they're a setting defined by the medium: a place for speakers of modern English to drop some of their inhibitions and engage in fun, often silly improv. Dungeons and Dragons: Honor Among Thieves was fully aware of this and leaned into it very heavily. If someone is using language that presupposes knowledge of cars, internet, social media, that's annoying. Otherwise, I really don't care.

I think this is more or less what OP is trying to say, and where I stand on the matter also.

[Dr. B]

I understand--I wasn't replying specifically to your point.

[Kuma]

And I was agreeing!

[Dr. B]

Ah, I gotcha!

<3

[Edens_Fall]

I think there's a balance to be struck here. While the Forgotten Realms are a setting, they're a setting defined by the medium it was created for: a game for people who speak modern languages to drop some of their inhibitions and engage in fun, often silly improv. Dungeons and Dragons: Honor Among Thieves, which is canon, was fully aware of this and leaned into it very heavily. If someone is using language that presupposes knowledge of cars, internet, social media, that's annoying and out of character. Otherwise, I really don't care.

Well stated. One can't stop the younger/modern generations from using the grammar structure they grew up with. As long as it's not bringing in the above, I have no issue personally. We all come here to relax and escape the real world. Let people have their fun. RL is crappy enough as is without having to worry about being judged and snubbed in a fantasy online world with talking with modern-age words.

[Sincra]

I don't think "Let people have fun" is a suitable argument here.

This is about meme posting, something that when done amongst others not in on the joke detracts from the server.
Equally, growing up with a specific lexicon is no excuse.
I started on this server when I was 16-18 (I now don't remember the exact dates) and I certainly did not use the lingo of my peers while roleplaying.

[Misericordus]

to be is to be perceived

you will be judged for everything you do, there is no escape

embrace unity and necessity and stop worrying about what other people think of you

we get the world we all deserve

[Windows95 CD-ROM]

I'll put my thoughts here since I am a person who could identify as being part of the 'younger generation' of NWN players within the past couple of years.

I think people have made some commentary about the style of writing that has been used in games like Baldur's Gate 3 or the new Dungeons and Dragons movie. While I have played enough of Baldur's Gate 3 to see what kind of language is used in the game, I've not seen the movie. My familiarity with how writing and language is handled best lies within the older writing style of the classic Forgotten Realms and other DnD books such as Dragonlance, and the older Baldur's Gate games.

These games are written with a very distinct prose and voice. Older languages and phrasings are used in dialogue, but not to the point of needing to be a professor of english in order to understand and appreciate the prose that is used. A mix of modernity, and old world language, but not to the point of sounding /too/ modern.

I think we have a responsibility to each other as roleplayers to be mindful and respectful towards the setting that has been made precedent by the fantasy medium. We also have a responsibility to respect each other's immersion, since that's why we're here to play and roleplay with each other, right? To immerse each other in a fantasy world?

I think it shows a lack of respect for the setting and the roleplay overall to use memes and clear internet terminology to emote or use in character, and I think it's a bit ingenuine to pass it off as just 'the kids being kids', because I am a person who is also young but I do not do this. Arelith isn't really a casual social roleplay server. It's a roleplay server, and we're here to enjoy each other's stories and concepts that we can create and mutually write together with one another.

[great balls of fire]

gentle reminder that my post does not tell anyone how to roleplay, or even to cut meme-posting in general out.

my issue is not with modern grammar structures or the nuances of modern speech. these are fine.

my issue is when the meme posting consumes an entire public social hub. think about it.

everyone is meme posting about rizz and drip and and imposters amongus and whatever other buzzword that has absolutely nothing to do with the current IC context, and some random stranger comes across it. how are they supposed to engage with that? It's very alienating for people who are trying to write in-character, in-setting, dare I say, seriously, when everyone else in a public space that's supposed to be for everyone is in goof troop hours. I have felt more snubbed by the goof troop for not participating in the memery; as though my character is cold, or strange, or stuck up, for not laughing along with the inside joke that would define what is "he is so mid fr cringe get ratio'd."

I have played BG3 and seen the D&D movie many times. No one is saying "cringe" or "ratio" nor are there any overt references to tiktok memes. Gale has never told me to go outside and touch some grass for licking a dead spider. He did hint to it by telling me to get some air, but never once was any internet slang invoked.

no one is saying don't have fun. just bare in mind everyone else is going to see you memeing around, so maybe think about whether or not what you're writing is necessarily the character you're trying to portray. if you want people to take you and your character seriously, you have to make at least an effort at taking your own writing seriously.

[Misericordus]

I agree completely, and will continue to ping the DM channel when I see intrusive in-character memery. It's for their own good.

These things are a great way to get noticed in all the wrong ways, and those who engage too freely will be shunned and ostracized as the immersion-breaking anti-roleplay irony-poisoned clowns they present themselves as.

This is neither a good nor a bad thing, nor is it something that can be changed by conscious effort to be less judgemental or more inclusive. It is simply what happens, unconsciously and automatically.

You can do your thing, and I will do mine. I guarantee that I am the one reaping the better rewards.

[stoneheart-]

Why even play here if you're not trying to immerse yourself in roleplay in a fantasy server?

If you want to be OOC and reference meme jokes, there are plenty of places to do that. Arelith even has its own discord server for you to meme on.

Seeing modernisms and meme posting makes me feel visceral disgust whenever I see them in public settings, and takes me out of the experience. Glad to see I'm not the only one. It's just disrespectful, not only to the setting but to other players who don't come to Arelith for that sort of thing. Everyone else that isn't memeing is giving it their best effort, only to have it dashed by someone saying some thinly-veiled "based and redpilled" thing, or whatever.

You're only degrading yourself in the eyes of others. It's not funny, and there is plenty of time to stop yourself from doing it in the time between you conceiving of the thought in your brain and typing it with your fingers. If you stop, and put forth the same effort as everyone else instead, I promise you will have more fun.

please reconsider before memeing ic

[Dr. B]

I don't think "Let people have fun" is a suitable argument here.

This is about meme posting, something that when done amongst others not in on the joke detracts from the server.
Equally, growing up with a specific lexicon is no excuse.
I started on this server when I was 16-18 (I now don't remember the exact dates) and I certainly did not use the lingo of my peers while roleplaying.

I agree that meme-posting is wrong, but the conversation since then has developed and now people are also arguing against using other modern phrasings and structures that are very hard to avoid for modern Englishs speakers, and I'm engaging with that. I don't care, for example, if someone begins a sentence with "I mean." "Let people have fun" is always an important consideration and one of the underpinning guidelines of the server and its rules, along with "stay in character." There's a balance to be struck between these two priorities and people who veer too far in either direction create toxicity.

Here's a thought: in the Lord of the Rings novels, the characters are not actually speaking English. They're speaking a language called "Westron," which Tolkien has "translated" into English for the reader. There's no FR equivalent for "Like comment and subscribe!!" but maybe there are FR equivalents for "I mean..."

I mean, why is the FR common tongue even English? Does anyone have a good answer to this? If we take the logic of some of the posters here too far, then our characters should all technically be speaking a fictional language, because there is no reason that an Earth language would find its way into the Forgotten Realms. You have to draw a line somewhere; I suggest that we draw it at avoiding toxic judginess and the un-fun policing of other people's language.