Herbalism Drinks - Fresh Mead and Yarrow Beers DO NOT STACK

[miesny_jez]

Description of Bug Experienced:
I am leaving this as a BUG because I don't see any sense why do craftable Drinks are not set to Stack.
Craftable Drinks as potions SHOULD stack.. otherwise there is no point of crafting them for things like shop selling

Steps to reproduce the Bug:
Craft 2x Fresh Mead or 2x Yarrow Beer

Expected Result:
Crafted Drinks can stack to form a single up to 100 stack

Actual Result:
Crafted Drinks do not stack and can only be singulars

Screenshot(s)
No need

Additional Information/Notes
N/A

[The GrumpyCat]

As per last discussion with the Dev of this, if these are ever made stackable then either
a) The ingredients must become a lot more rare and difficult to obtain, in line with the value of the drinks themselves mechanically
b) And/or a lot more crafting points will be required to make them.

Otherwise the lack of stackability is not a bug, it is entirely intended and is for balence.

[A Digital Vagrant]

Personally really wouldn't mind an increase in CP for them to be able to stack.

People hardly buy them because they don't stack.

[The GrumpyCat]

Addendum: I've moved this to the Feedback area - as this is intentional as balence by the creator.

Just because you don't like something, does not make it a 'Bug.'

[In Sorrow We Trust]

I mentioned similar before; my opinion is increase CP cost and allow them to stack. I don't think it would hurt to have the buffs last a little longer if drank in a tavern either

[DM MoonMoon]

Hey miesny_jez

I was the one who designed the specialist drinks!
I have been taking on some feedback to look at improving it (was hoping to finish before christmas honestly, but life gets in the way!)

There are some changes coming, but the drinks will stay Non_Stack, for mainly balance reasons but it also fits with the new update I will be implementing.

No_Stack has had some issues recently but should be fixed (or soon fixed?) this affected not only the drinks but some other items also!

Keep on the lookout for the update

[miesny_jez]

Thanks for reply everyone.

I really hope that the upcoming changes will make it sensible for the drinks to be as a selling material in the shops and consumables you can carry, right now they are not.

They serve a very very similiar purpose as for example potions created with the Brew Potion feat but with the additional tax of time needed and materials.. whereas the brewed potions require nothing more then a 6s cast of a spell.

[Svrtr]

Thanks for reply everyone.

I really hope that the upcoming changes will make it sensible for the drinks to be as a selling material in the shops and consumables you can carry, right now they are not.

They serve a very very similiar purpose as for example potions created with the Brew Potion feat but with the additional tax of time needed and materials.. whereas the brewed potions require nothing more then a 6s cast of a spell.

Keep in mind too part of the balance part is the drinks have powerful effects such as healing 40% of your max health or making you immune to poison for a duration. Hence in part why they don't stack, so you can't have hours of poison immunity in one stack of items or just healing potion++

[DM MoonMoon]

The new change should hopefully encourage more brewer/cook and inn roleplay.
Coming soon! (TM)

[miesny_jez]

Ahhh I see what was the idea for those..

It was more about actually selling them IN the inn instead of making them as typical consumable products? Am I right?

If that's the case then they do miss the mark as they are simply too weak/too short lasting and .. well too similiar to buffs you get from scrolls/brewed potions.
I would think uniqness/power would have to be the main why people would want to seek it then? And of course higher CPs power comes with price. Example of a unique drink let's say loot luck drinks maybe? A miners luck.. a crafter's luck.. or hells even a Harry Potter liquid luck drink why not?

The second part is taverns are not something people look into too often in today's Arelith (subjective experience) - I mean sure they are used for some meetings occasionally but even the Andunor tavern in the Hub is not often used .. more often people seem to be rather idling at the portal or even on the couches just beside the tavern.

Well this will probably be a stupid idea but could we make the fireplaces/cauldrons become a temporary tavern for the purpose of those speciality drinks? I don't know if that would work.. considering my most recent dungeon runs in groups are very quick, I suppose too quick even but just everything dies so quickly.

We never actually do a "let's stop" for a moment of a warm fireplace inside the dungeon, maybe I will start trying to force it out more but the problem with that is what's the incentive to do that? I mean everyone has a limited time to play and most of RP does happen in the cities anyway.

In theory it should be let's pause get a breath in maybe when we will be more relaxed we will be better at finding some details.
Ehh just probably rambling here.

[DM MoonMoon]

Hi miesny_jez

It looks like your close to what im going to be doing
The first iteration was an experiment, and now things are getting tweeked.
I am also planning on moving away from "Special inn bonus FOIG" to -> what it actually does.

Hoping to have this out to you all soon.

[Paint]

I'm against these drinks stacking. At least one of them restores 40% of your HP for a sobriety hit, which is actually better than a heal pot in a pinch if your hp pool is big enough, and that's Kind of a Big Deal.

[AstralUniverse]

I honestly dont think it's better than a Heal pot in most situations when we also consider that:

• It knocks down a lot of sobriety, roughly x3 more than a heal pot. While it scales directly with max hp, it's sobriety cost is fixed on 50% last I checked, and heal pot's sobriety cost goes down, the higher the con mod is.
• It doesnt actually just heal 40% hp, it ticks up over 12 seconds.

I think having these drinks unstackable is one way to balance them but it's a really annoying way. It punishes the shop-keeper who wants to sell them more than it punishes the user who gets the value from them in battle. I cant speak for others but I personally never ever see Golden Spirits in shops, and very rarely bar drinks at all. Last time I played a herbalist I had issues selling them in a temp shop at the hub even tho I'm pretty sure the price was at the floor.

I would prefer the recipes and/or crafting points would be the points of balance.

[Drogo Gyslain]

DM Moonmoon's efforts to create an RP-focused item are definately on point.

I'm seeing more and more posts, wanting to max everything, to get the best stats, to the the most points, the best everything....

You do not need another 100x stack of healing items in your inventory.

you can already stack 100x Healing Packs... 100x Healing Draughts.... Potions of Heal.... Scrolls of Healing and Mass Healing...

Why can't we have 1 item, which is designed to be really easy to make, really easy to source, that is designed to be a 'drink it at the bar' drink?

Something Jeff can grab and sit with his buddies to sip on while he hears of the tale of the bandit goblin on the traderoads terrorizing a dwarf that he smacked with his axe and saved the dwarf, only to find out the dwarf was a necromancer!

We should be supporting this, and if you need a solid in game reason? Make the drinks like wolfsbane, after x number of hours, the drinks lose their potency. Make them heal 1d4 after say... 1 day of creation to fight hoarding of yet another stackable resource.

Why does everything have to be minmaxxed to death? Why do we need another inventory slot stacked up to the sky with bottles of yet another liquid healing miracle?

[Svrtr]

DM Moonmoon's efforts to create an RP-focused item are definately on point.

I'm seeing more and more posts, wanting to max everything, to get the best stats, to the the most points, the best everything....

You do not need another 100x stack of healing items in your inventory.

you can already stack 100x Healing Packs... 100x Healing Draughts.... Potions of Heal.... Scrolls of Healing and Mass Healing...

Why can't we have 1 item, which is designed to be really easy to make, really easy to source, that is designed to be a 'drink it at the bar' drink?

Something Jeff can grab and sit with his buddies to sip on while he hears of the tale of the bandit goblin on the traderoads terrorizing a dwarf that he smacked with his axe and saved the dwarf, only to find out the dwarf was a necromancer!

We should be supporting this, and if you need a solid in game reason? Make the drinks like wolfsbane, after x number of hours, the drinks lose their potency. Make them heal 1d4 after say... 1 day of creation to fight hoarding of yet another stackable resource.

Why does everything have to be minmaxxed to death? Why do we need another inventory slot stacked up to the sky with bottles of yet another liquid healing miracle?

I won't argue one way or another myself and just like playing devil's advocate, but if you don't want numbers couldn't one just drink the existing drinks at the bar? The ones with no effect and that just reduce sobriety and rest? If it's just to be an rp item too then mechanics aren't necessary either

[Drogo Gyslain]

Because why can't we have an item that is meant to be both? A Good healing item that's cheap and easy to source and doesn't take a whole bunch of crafting points, and an RP item that entices and incentivises social RP and congregation?

I'm legit asking, what is so wrong about having it not stack. With the dozens of actual options out there that already stack, why are we making a big deal about an item simply because you can't stack 100 of them and walk around with yet another magically-small giant pile of bottles or mugs?

Because all I see, is people complaining that they can't be greedy and make another sack of coin over this.

[Eira]

Perhaps they could be limited to stacks of 10.

[AstralUniverse]

Because why can't we have an item that is meant to be both? A Good healing item that's cheap and easy to source and doesn't take a whole bunch of crafting points, and an RP item that entices and incentivises social RP and congregation?

Sure, if you want to also have the item extremely rare to see, and mostly just unused except for pvp optimization by a narrow selection of barbarian-ish builds in case of golden spirits and yarrow beer, or just unused at all in case of other bar drinks.

[DM MoonMoon]

Perhaps they could be limited to stacks of 10.

Stacks are defined by the model or off with NO_STACK
Wont be needed anyway, and will be remaining NO_STACK.

If I finish it by Christmas happy days! If not, will be soon (tm)

[ReverentBlade]

Balancing around inventory inconvenience is an...interesting decision on an RP server with an already bloated crafting system. All those journals and notebooks and RP gifts and mementos are now, per design decision, a legitimate hindrance to character power. Probably not the precedent you want to be setting going forward.