Surface Evil Needs Another Home

[Hazard]

What about a sort of apartment complex that can only be owned by a Dread Pirate, but tenants can be anyone?
The building could be Sencliff themed, like ... I dunno. An old ship that's no longer sea-worthy, and is now grounded up on the land and remade into an apartment/hotel sorta deal, with shady characters and all.

[The Amazing Squidman]

Please do not allow non-inked to buy quarters in Sencliff. Other settlements already have a problem of outsiders hogging all their best quarters. If anything quarters should have stricter requirements on who is allowed to live there, you should be a citizen, be the correct race(s), and it should be a lot more expensive so we don't have groups of brand new characters still doing their Cordor writs buying up half a dozen desirable properties at once.

My impression has been that there is always free quarters in Sencliff. I also think that the houses and crew houses should be for pirates only. But those little quarters and bank vaults could be free for all.

I think then we'd see a bunch of ridiculous things like goodly elves and paladins renting vaults under Sencliff's feast hall just for the storage, and PVPing any filthy pirate scum they see along the way in and out. Sorry but exclusivity is a good thing and so is meritocracy, I'd actually like to see other settlements have similar ranking/writ systems as Sencliff to stop all these day 1 characters coming in and buying up the nicest places out from under the noses of long-time citizens who have been waiting RL months or years for a good house to become available. In my experience settlement leaders aren't handing out evictions where they should, and the bidding system is getting gamed by OOC groups (even if unintentionally) who roll tons of alts so they can place as many bids as possible, then it's no surprise when every house in a settlement ends up with the same surname on it.

[Edens_Fall]

Dropping in a few points for consideration. These points don't neccesarly overrule any good ideas - they're just 'huh, keep this in mind.'

b) I believe it's been argued that if there WAS an Evil Settlment (capital E - we're talking undead, demons ect) Settlment (again Captial S, as in full voting ect) then how do you keep it evil? Sure, maybe the settlment status stops folk from charging in and pvping you, but nothing stops them from just coming in next election term and voting you out, and making it the Not At All Evil Settlment. I suppose some sort of mechanic could be put in place to stop that (Can only vote if Evil) but such things are clunky, to say the least. It might also mean a settlment with very low population. (Please note the 'might' there- given as another point I make later may contradict this)

This would be pretty easy to handle I think, using a system not Unlike Guld. An Evil settlement ruled by an Evil NPC leader(s) with a set codex of laws that elected players can't override. While I wouldn't want Devils and Undead walking the streets (Can have such an act be a minor violation warranting a fine), I would want a law stating a PC can't be exiled, pariah, or discriminated against if found to be using such outside the city or in private. This is what gets most surface evil players in trouble. Once discovered, due to the way surface settlements work together, news is spread and that PC is basically Pariah from every location and free to be hunted by whatever Team Good PvP party is bored that day. This leaves them only one real place to fall back to that offers any sort of true safety. Andunor.

As far as Team Good rushing in to steal an election? Well, that's when the DM NPC leader steps in to create some interesting RP situations. Oh? Are you a paladin who just won the election? Well done, now your overlord has a mission for you. Relocate the nearby village of peasants, using your sword and the provided undead troops, so we can have more farmland. Don't want to? It wasn't a choice dear servant. head removal for failing to honor your evil lord. They do it? Alignment adjustment, and they are no longer good! Problem solved and RP generated. Setting restored.

[Xerah]

Exactly what Edens_Fall said is how you deal with that.

There's a nation in the Pathfinder campaign setting with places that have undead farmers (Geb) in a place ruled by a ghost necromancer and a place ruled by Asmodeus (Cheliax) which are both very cool locations in my opinion. Not saying that these need to be duplicated here, but they are certainly not lame because undead or devils are in the "streets".

With a good ruler there, it is the equivalent of an evil ruler in a "good" place where you try to do things right up to the line (without going over--or do go over and take the push back from time to time). It doesn't have to be a ruler, it can just be an underling who has to do [opposite alignment] task. These types of setups are very cool and something that I've tried to foster when running settlements in the past. Maybe people don't like this sort of thing and it's just me.

In the example of the citizens needing to be moved, you could as a good character, work with the harpers to have the village appear slaughtered while they were actually taken and raised back to life (or just not killed at all). Or you could refuse to do it, get put on trial, and then be executed by the leader (NPC or PC) with a permadeath (a nice martyr play).

[BHR55]

I have my doubts this would happen but Wharftown had ghostly buildings phasing into the prime material. On the Prime it could be restored as a Shadovar sponsored "settlement" or town, maybe partnered with Zhents, Red Wizards or w.e Arelith faction they choose to establish to fill that role above the player government. Maybe even a weird council of thieves and warlords vs a single chancellor.

This would fill a niche since a shadow door to the planer side could then serve as an underbelly for whatever underdarker visits etc people might want. It already has a space that could be used for the darker side of it's town framework, without adding a sewer for sewer gangs lol. So monsters are not welcomed in the streets, but what happens on the (literally) dark side of town is anything goes. It's connected to a trade hub and a neutral zone already so there is some room to see it naturally expand, so it would likely be a good candidate for that sort of thing.

I'm not sure the server population has the people to support it thought with Guldorand as Cordor being as large as they are, but at least it has room to be a bit more varied vs just the Bane church or Zhentil Keep light. A bunch of mages overseeing the place also explains why it's not just gobbled up by Cordor and Guld, and Amn isn't as heavy handed post war so maybe it could work out.

It would ultimately come down to how players treat the space, since raiding places and retreating expecting no consequences won't work out long term before it's destroyed again if it's abused. At least your options aren't be irrelevant in Sibayad(Where you will still be hunted), become a pirate, or become Underdarker if people play their cards right. The codex of ethics or laws from the pie in the sky NPC faction that runs the place as has already been mentioned would hopefully sort this part out.

The Radiant Heart is a far cry from the Canon organization whose name they use, and anyone with a reward and meets the qualifications is pretty much encouraged to join for the extra writs if nothing else. It's very wide spread given the mechanical incentive and fairly lax policy to join to take part in said writs. Defiantly feels like everyone and their mother on the surface is a member, that you can practically tell who doesn't meet the alignment or nobility requirements just by their not having a ring. Which isn't a complaint, its just how it is currently so I assume its working as intended.

[-XXX-]

I'm not saying Sencliff isn't all these things. I'm saying that, as Sencliff has, and does, accept things that are undeniably capital-e Evil, then - they've taken that step beyond banditry. It's not enough to say 'I've rejected the laws of man', but they've gone beyond that. Necromancy, fiendish summoning, are not simply violations of human law, but cosmic violations of the natural order. They are crimes against the world as a whole.

Now, do I think Sencliff should be protected from gank squads? Yes. However, pretending Sencliff are just a rebellious bunch isn't true. They've gone beyond that, in who and what they've accepted, who they work with, and so asking why they're targeted is, at this point, deliberately missing the difference between evil and Evil, as discussed above.

Also, I don't think saying 'you can't work to do something new without fixing this first' is letting the conversation move on. It should be part of an overall conversation, and having strong rules on inter-settlement conflict as part of that is definitely something you want to include

Nobody's pretending that Sencliff isn't a morally bankrupt place, however I can't even recall a time when at least half of the island wouldn't be angry at Myon and that place doesn't get torched on regular basis.

And yes, I suspect one of the primary reasons behind this thread is the fact that virtually the entire Surface narratively supports capital G, which leaves very little space for capital E to exist in. ATM we have:

• Sencliff - that has basically adapted to serve this purpose and meet the demand
• Dis/Shadovar - too niche and rather unpopulated (due to neither being a starting place, among other reasons)
• Andunor - at some point we might actually want to reconsider treating Sharps as some kind of scrapyard for used up villains who brazenly refused to roll after being found out

[Babylon System is the Vampire]

I have my doubts this would happen but Wharftown had ghostly buildings phasing into the prime material. On the Prime it could be restored as a Shadovar sponsored "settlement" or town, maybe partnered with Zhents, Red Wizards or w.e Arelith faction they choose to establish to fill that role above the player government. Maybe even a weird council of thieves and warlords vs a single chancellor.

I think there is a lot of potential in a shadovar backed settlement as well, perhaps as much as a bannite version. I don't like the idea of randomly lumping the zhents in with the shadovar because one of the shadovar's biggest enemies when they returned over the anaroch desert were actually the zhentarim who had caravan routes that ran through it, but if done right, it has some potential.

But doing it right is the key, because the shadovar are tier 0 enemies that can more or less wipe out anyone in the forgotten realms in a one vs one war, meaning they could make an isolated island like arelith completely theirs without much effort. Having them as a main bad guy without any guidelines around how its approached would be akin to running a campaign for 5 level 2 lovitarians and sending them to storm Elminsters Windmill.

[BHR55]

...

...
I don't like the idea of randomly lumping the zhents in with the shadovar because one of the shadovar's biggest enemies when they returned over the anaroch desert were actually the zhentarim who had caravan routes that ran through it, but if done right, it has some potential.

But doing it right is the key, because the shadovar are tier 0 enemies that can more or less wipe out anyone in the forgotten realms in a one vs one war, meaning they could make an isolated island like arelith completely theirs without much effort.

During the Archwizards Return, and really in the first book where our Arelith Timeline freezes for world events, and in our wiki for what is known- those events that see the Shadovar Destroy Zhentil keep have not yet come to pass. Currently they are courting partnerships and alliances which include the Zhents and the Thayans.
They also appear to be helping the forces of the Lords Alliance in Evereska, before more things unfold later in the timeline.

The only faction I recall that they have screwed over at this point in time(Ignoring their changing the weather to make their lake), is really the Cult of the Dragon. Because Telemont had a chat with their Dracolich setting him free of their control and dominating it.

But yes, the point was really that the location currently has potential for existing dual use with some minimal face-lifting of the primer material facing town, and there are factions that could make it viable. Reusing Thay in Three cities might be a bit much, and Bane has his place too in those two as well(sort of).

[Quizmar]

I think Sibayad is a perfect home for surface evil. All that needs to happen is for the resident Cordorian nobles that own half the properties to be removed. Sibayad also needs to be a proper settlement and the laws be changed to be more explicitly friendly towards UDers and evildoers.

[Anomandaris]

Or how about we actually do something interesting with shadow Wharftown? It was a cool and unique place for seedy folk from above, below, and other planes to meet and rp. Now it’s a dumpster fire and has been for some time. It’s a missed opportunity imo for a more “useful” area that could be fixed pretty easily.

[MissEvelyn]

...

...
I don't like the idea of randomly lumping the zhents in with the shadovar because one of the shadovar's biggest enemies when they returned over the anaroch desert were actually the zhentarim who had caravan routes that ran through it, but if done right, it has some potential.

But doing it right is the key, because the shadovar are tier 0 enemies that can more or less wipe out anyone in the forgotten realms in a one vs one war, meaning they could make an isolated island like arelith completely theirs without much effort.

During the Archwizards Return, and really in the first book where our Arelith Timeline freezes for world events, and in our wiki for what is known- those events that see the Shadovar Destroy Zhentil keep have not yet come to pass. Currently they are courting partnerships and alliances which include the Zhents and the Thayans.
They also appear to be helping the forces of the Lords Alliance in Evereska, before more things unfold later in the timeline.

The fact that Galaeron never learned to control his shadow self in the Arelith timeline is chilling to think about.

Spoiler added for those who haven't read the Archwizards Return. They're really good, and the first novel especially since it ends right around when Arelith diverged from the timeline.

[Itikar]

Or how about we actually do something interesting with shadow Wharftown? It was a cool and unique place for seedy folk from above, below, and other planes to meet and rp. Now it’s a dumpster fire and has been for some time. It’s a missed opportunity imo for a more “useful” area that could be fixed pretty easily.

I really miss Shadow Wharftown when it was more inhabitable. It had that quiet, morbid charm that was just spectacular. I never really understood or appeciated much the purpose for the changes to it. I did not see any benefit from them for either setting or roleplay other than the DMed events involving the change.

Bring back the temple with that funny hag and the shadowhunter guild!

[Waldo52]

Again the OP disappeared for a while do to real life responsibilities and generally being busy, but I'm back. Again there's a lot that I could respond to, but I'd like to address this:

I've avoided replying directly to this thread for a while, mainly because I genuinely dislike the notion of 'team good' and 'team evil' and in fact think it harmful to setting & gameplay. I absolutely won't build towards it. Evil should be in competition with itself, and ideally most characters will hold aspects of both good and evil within themselves, and tell a story a good deal more nuanced than 'forces of light and darkness' nonsense.

I've played in Sencliff lately, and it's actually nice to see this in action. It's not full of an all-black snarky edge crowd then routinely goes looking to kill for the sake of it. I aimed for a somewhat anarchist anti-establishment vibe there, and for the most part this works quite well.

What I've zero interest in having on surface is a town where zombies stand around on the street, cartoon villains sneer at each other, and the main pass time is for level 30 gank squads to seek conflict for its own sake, devoid of any narrative or ambition. I removed the war system for this reason, and it was a large part that Wharftown was destroyed after many failed attempts to intervene and curtail the mindless PvP that originated there. Heck, Wharftown isn't even designed as an 'evil' settlement, and seeing it become such a place just undermined it.

I'm certainly not against having Wharftown return from the Shadow Plane, in fact the ground work has been laid for that, but the notion that it might return how it was in the months before its removal leave me inclined to let it rest in peace.

If one really wants to play 'absolute' evil, then sure - go to Dis.

It's a pretty radical departure from the fantasy genre to avoid the epic struggle between good and evil. It's a bizarre design decision, but I don't necessarily think that makes it bad.

However if we want to avoid the endless cycle of guys with glowy white swords killbashing guys with glowy red swords I think there are better solutions than geographically isolating evil players and giving them massive financial and mechanical incentives against causing problems.

Consider the NPC gang in the ruins of Wharftown. They don't summon demons or zombies as far as I can remember. They don't seem ideologically anti-good as much as they seem driven by profit and the bandit way of life. Could you imagine that a couple of them are necromancers or blackguards? Sure, but they're definitely not that kind of faction. And the sad truth is that the Wharftown NPC mobs have been more of a threat to any of my characters than any in-game robbery or evil-doer faction. They must have killed me three or four times over the course of as many years, lol.

I'm reading the room and getting a feel for what everyone's been saying on this thread, I'm seeing your own bias against LOTR style good versus evil narratives. But if we can't have a city where surface drow lead their zombies over sewage soaked streets and demons are summoned freely as a middle finger to the rest of the continent, can't we just have a place where real people with bad in-character intentions can strive to do as much harm as a group of low level mobs?

I'm not saying any of this would be problem or drama free. I'm not going to pick between any of the wonderful suggestions like bringing back Wharftown or making it Sibayad or making a new town. But this is a feedback thread and I'm really burnt out by the current state of evil characters being relegated to costume parties underground or on a boat or on some plane that I don't want to visit. The server is making hooliganism and crime impossible because there's no place for bandits and bullies to congregate.

I would highly encourage a DM or dev to try taking an evil character to Sencliff or the Hub and asking other characters if they want to go hunting and you'll see what I'm talking about. The characters that don't ignore you, insist on going sailing instead or tell you that they want to hang out for a while and have to meet someone will just tell you that they're not ready yet and need to focus on their five year plan while they browse the shops for adamantine.

I know that Arelith supports and rewards this kind of roleplay and we can't have every walk on the road become a PVP experience but I see nothing resembling a happy balance here. Evil feels dull and this otherwise compelling server feels like a safe space for fictional characters.

[Hazard]

Again the OP disappeared for a while do to real life responsibilities and generally being busy, but I'm back. Again there's a lot that I could respond to, but I'd like to address this:

I've avoided replying directly to this thread for a while, mainly because I genuinely dislike the notion of 'team good' and 'team evil' and in fact think it harmful to setting & gameplay. I absolutely won't build towards it. Evil should be in competition with itself, and ideally most characters will hold aspects of both good and evil within themselves, and tell a story a good deal more nuanced than 'forces of light and darkness' nonsense.

I've played in Sencliff lately, and it's actually nice to see this in action. It's not full of an all-black snarky edge crowd then routinely goes looking to kill for the sake of it. I aimed for a somewhat anarchist anti-establishment vibe there, and for the most part this works quite well.

What I've zero interest in having on surface is a town where zombies stand around on the street, cartoon villains sneer at each other, and the main pass time is for level 30 gank squads to seek conflict for its own sake, devoid of any narrative or ambition. I removed the war system for this reason, and it was a large part that Wharftown was destroyed after many failed attempts to intervene and curtail the mindless PvP that originated there. Heck, Wharftown isn't even designed as an 'evil' settlement, and seeing it become such a place just undermined it.

I'm certainly not against having Wharftown return from the Shadow Plane, in fact the ground work has been laid for that, but the notion that it might return how it was in the months before its removal leave me inclined to let it rest in peace.

If one really wants to play 'absolute' evil, then sure - go to Dis.

It's a pretty radical departure from the fantasy genre to avoid the epic struggle between good and evil. It's a bizarre design decision, but I don't necessarily think that makes it bad.

However if we want to avoid the endless cycle of guys with glowy white swords killbashing guys with glowy red swords I think there are better solutions than geographically isolating evil players and giving them massive financial and mechanical incentives against causing problems.

Consider the NPC gang in the ruins of Wharftown. They don't summon demons or zombies as far as I can remember. They don't seem ideologically anti-good as much as they seem driven by profit and the bandit way of life. Could you imagine that a couple of them are necromancers or blackguards? Sure, but they're definitely not that kind of faction. And the sad truth is that the Wharftown NPC mobs have been more of a threat to any of my characters than any in-game robbery or evil-doer faction. They must have killed me three or four times over the course of as many years, lol.

I'm reading the room and getting a feel for what everyone's been saying on this thread, I'm seeing your own bias against LOTR style good versus evil narratives. But if we can't have a city where surface drow lead their zombies over sewage soaked streets and demons are summoned freely as a middle finger to the rest of the continent, can't we just have a place where real people with bad in-character intentions can strive to do as much harm as a group of low level mobs?

I'm not saying any of this would be problem or drama free. I'm not going to pick between any of the wonderful suggestions like bringing back Wharftown or making it Sibayad or making a new town. But this is a feedback thread and I'm really burnt out by the current state of evil characters being relegated to costume parties underground or on a boat or on some plane that I don't want to visit. The server is making hooliganism and crime impossible because there's no place for bandits and bullies to congregate.

I would highly encourage a DM or dev to try taking an evil character to Sencliff or the Hub and asking other characters if they want to go hunting and you'll see what I'm talking about. The characters that don't ignore you, insist on going sailing instead or tell you that they want to hang out for a while and have to meet someone will just tell you that they're not ready yet and need to focus on their five year plan while they browse the shops for adamantine.

I know that Arelith supports and rewards this kind of roleplay and we can't have every walk on the road become a PVP experience but I see nothing resembling a happy balance here. Evil feels dull and this otherwise compelling server feels like a safe space for fictional characters.

There's more to being evil than being a murder-hobo.

[Waldo52]

Deleted post. Glitch.

[Waldo52]

Again the OP disappeared for a while do to real life responsibilities and generally being busy, but I'm back. Again there's a lot that I could respond to, but I'd like to address this:

I've avoided replying directly to this thread for a while, mainly because I genuinely dislike the notion of 'team good' and 'team evil' and in fact think it harmful to setting & gameplay. I absolutely won't build towards it. Evil should be in competition with itself, and ideally most characters will hold aspects of both good and evil within themselves, and tell a story a good deal more nuanced than 'forces of light and darkness' nonsense.

I've played in Sencliff lately, and it's actually nice to see this in action. It's not full of an all-black snarky edge crowd then routinely goes looking to kill for the sake of it. I aimed for a somewhat anarchist anti-establishment vibe there, and for the most part this works quite well.

What I've zero interest in having on surface is a town where zombies stand around on the street, cartoon villains sneer at each other, and the main pass time is for level 30 gank squads to seek conflict for its own sake, devoid of any narrative or ambition. I removed the war system for this reason, and it was a large part that Wharftown was destroyed after many failed attempts to intervene and curtail the mindless PvP that originated there. Heck, Wharftown isn't even designed as an 'evil' settlement, and seeing it become such a place just undermined it.

I'm certainly not against having Wharftown return from the Shadow Plane, in fact the ground work has been laid for that, but the notion that it might return how it was in the months before its removal leave me inclined to let it rest in peace.

If one really wants to play 'absolute' evil, then sure - go to Dis.

It's a pretty radical departure from the fantasy genre to avoid the epic struggle between good and evil. It's a bizarre design decision, but I don't necessarily think that makes it bad.

However if we want to avoid the endless cycle of guys with glowy white swords killbashing guys with glowy red swords I think there are better solutions than geographically isolating evil players and giving them massive financial and mechanical incentives against causing problems.

Consider the NPC gang in the ruins of Wharftown. They don't summon demons or zombies as far as I can remember. They don't seem ideologically anti-good as much as they seem driven by profit and the bandit way of life. Could you imagine that a couple of them are necromancers or blackguards? Sure, but they're definitely not that kind of faction. And the sad truth is that the Wharftown NPC mobs have been more of a threat to any of my characters than any in-game robbery or evil-doer faction. They must have killed me three or four times over the course of as many years, lol.

I'm reading the room and getting a feel for what everyone's been saying on this thread, I'm seeing your own bias against LOTR style good versus evil narratives. But if we can't have a city where surface drow lead their zombies over sewage soaked streets and demons are summoned freely as a middle finger to the rest of the continent, can't we just have a place where real people with bad in-character intentions can strive to do as much harm as a group of low level mobs?

I'm not saying any of this would be problem or drama free. I'm not going to pick between any of the wonderful suggestions like bringing back Wharftown or making it Sibayad or making a new town. But this is a feedback thread and I'm really burnt out by the current state of evil characters being relegated to costume parties underground or on a boat or on some plane that I don't want to visit. The server is making hooliganism and crime impossible because there's no place for bandits and bullies to congregate.

I would highly encourage a DM or dev to try taking an evil character to Sencliff or the Hub and asking other characters if they want to go hunting and you'll see what I'm talking about. The characters that don't ignore you, insist on going sailing instead or tell you that they want to hang out for a while and have to meet someone will just tell you that they're not ready yet and need to focus on their five year plan while they browse the shops for adamantine.

I know that Arelith supports and rewards this kind of roleplay and we can't have every walk on the road become a PVP experience but I see nothing resembling a happy balance here. Evil feels dull and this otherwise compelling server feels like a safe space for fictional characters.

There's more to being evil than being a murder-hobo.

Why does wanting to engage in banditry constitute being a murderhobo? As much as I usually enjoy your posts, I'm a bit confused here.

I see bandits as a problem that existed throughout history and as a staple of any medieval adjacent setting.

Please explain.

If villains on Arelith are expected to be men who tent their fingers while their minions craft valuable items to gather funds for some future DM approved raid in four months, if anyone uninterested in PvP content will be able to declare their non-consent from this kind of role-play and avoid it, I think an announcement declaring this sentiment would be warranted and I would leave the server.

If on the other hand we want just a little bit of conflict, I think we need to have some kind of home for troublemakers.

Sencliff doesn't do anything evil.

Andunor does something evil maybe every few weeks but god help you if you have a job or a personal life

As for the potential perils of enabling actual villains, if someone does something evil to you and you think it was a rule break, report it. For Snuggle a Bugbear's sake I got in trouble with the DM team even when every single victim was given a legitimate RP out from being murdered. Reporting bad conduct, real or imagined, is as easy as changing your chat box from "general" to "DM" and airing your grievances.

I'm sick of sailing in circles, I'm sick of talking about Andunorian shop profits. Your gold or your life.

If the team thinks this makes me a "murderhobo", I will respectfully accept a lifetime ban or leave of my own accord. Believe or or not you might find the server a much more boring environment without my kind. Bandit RP is lawman RP. Have fun in Bendir talking about the next election and stockpiling siege equipment on the cliff for use against the next NPC vessel you find.

[Hazard]

Please explain.

Alright, but I'm day drinking.

I don't mean murder-hobo as a completely derogatory phrase, or that it is entirely unwanted. Some amount of killer psychopaths are fun in any open world PvP game.

But having said that, pvp in the form of banditry is often just overplayed and can come across as shallow or repetitive. Think of how many players we have and how many timezones that playercount covers. Stay logged in an unhealthy amount of time consecutively (thanks insomnia) and you quickly realise there's a lot of banditry going on, all the time. Sometimes you may run into victims who think this is exciting and new because to them it is, and that's great! ... but you should also keep in mind that for a lot of people this might be the nth bandit this tenday on just that character, and having a never ending stream of shallow conflict might just not seem so important once you run into someone who is trying to create a new plague, or overthrow the government to install evil cultists to power.

There are quite a lot of evil things going on that you/your character may not be aware of, because it isn't surface level or bragged about out in the open. There are plots and schemes to ruin peoples lives, political careers, factions, etc always happening, whether in Andunor, Cordor, Myon or any settlement really. Whether it's a long-term plan to shift the alignment of an entire settlement and its population to increase the amount of worshippers for your Dark God or if its to corrupt an individual's soul, or anything else, I promise you evil things are always happening, it's just often kept secret both IC & OOC because of how swiftly a swarm of "good-guys" are able to show up and put an end to it.

The depth of peoples villainous RP often goes beyond just providing immediate conflict in the form of a threat of PvP, which isn't always the most creative or impactful in the long-term, only because of how common it is.

Of course, none of that means there's no place for it. It's just something to be mindful of.
To reiterate, briefly...

1. Banditry has a place, but banditry alone is not a compelling story or interaction. It will inspire "law RP" in the form of people showing up to try and kill the bandit/chase them away. If the bandit is killed, they will probably respawn and come back soon (if they're cheesey) or will stay away for quite some time. Best case scenario you might get some more creative law RP where they try to arrest, imprison, take you to trial, etc, but they will likely only do this if they expect their time investment to be respected and taken seriously in turn.

2. There is absolutely evil stuff happening, everywhere, all the time. Very evil stuff, of both the mundane murder/assassination/theft variety, and the more grand or cosmic of scale.

[MRFTW]

I don't mean murder-hobo as a derogatory phrase

Sure it isn't.

[Hazard]

I don't mean murder-hobo as a derogatory phrase

Sure it isn't.

I'm at least half sure.
There, I edited it for you.

[Anomandaris]

Please explain.

Alright, but I'm day drinking…….

Well said and 100% on. You should day drink more often…

[Hazard]

Please explain.

Alright, but I'm day drinking…….

Well said and 100% on. You should day drink more often…

Don't have to tell me twice.

[Iceborn]

Boring villains have been always an issue, as much as boring heroes. Not to diss anybody in special of course, but in a RP server, if the extent of your imagination for villain RP is to merely go and killbash some [enemy faction], you are probably going to bore yourself and every involved to tears, if not outright frustrate them and instill further the 'I must win' mentality.

A huge issue regarding that, given how mechanically heavy the server has become, is there are no actual RP mechanics to play the villain consequences. Disease, curses, any sort of wound you can inflict in the player that matters is relegated entirely to the text-only realm. And not all effects need to be negative. We could have mechanically enforced pacts between characters, we could have systems that encourage corruption, we could have a lot more than we currently have. Mechanics that should compliment the RP, instead of being entirely divorced one another - which to me has always been a strange design decision, to keep adding Content (TM) without adding more actual RP tools in what is still essentially an RP-focused server.

[Ruzuke]

My fey creature has been trying to get a team together to work on developing a curse to destroy Bendir Dale for a few months.

In my mind it would start with fey creatures randomly stealing worthless items, progress to fey creatures just showing up and hanging out in town enmass. Minor to annoying harassment, which while annoying is not outright lethal, just an issue to deal with.

There is also the plan to set the entire town on fire and steal the Exo bench (once it is has been found) and set it into the vault. The first one I think would be a lot of fun.

[zeroth777]

Actually I already have an idea for this .

It is a concept idea of a writ master for evil aligned surface faction with their HQ at the bane temple in Minmir.

I have already been to that bane temple and I feel it’s a wonderful concept that is not yet fully grown to their fullest potential.

So my idea is to develop evil writs with the writ master at that bane temple, with perhaps some writ progression into a useful gear, similar to that of radiant heart.

And there will be ranks like dreadlords for melee evil knights, doomsayers priests with death domains and such.

Not really for an eternal PvP but for evil characters to flesh out their rp in their writs , though some conflicts will always be there for good and evil.

What do u guys think?

[Edens_Fall]

A neat idea, though be aware team Good will KB and Pariah anyone wearing the gear if it shows up like RH ring does.