Epic Dodge and Knockdown

[Waldo52]

There was recently an update which mentioned that certain special attacks now respect ED. Is knockdown effected by epic dodge currently?

It's a very important question for me because I'm trying to figure out what the magic discipline number is for me as a rogue with a base STR of 13.

[AstralUniverse]

Epic dodge will eat the first attack in the enemy's attack round sequence. If the enemy is spamming KD on you, the first attack in their round sequence isnt their only max ab attack because they are likely also hasted. So you can (and should) entirely ignore the presence of epic dodge when you decide how much discipline you need. This is regardless if there's a bug or not.

[Waldo52]

Epic dodge will eat the first attack in the enemy's attack round sequence. If the enemy is spamming KD on you, the first attack in their round sequence isnt their only max ab attack because they are likely also hasted. So you can (and should) entirely ignore the presence of epic dodge when you decide how much discipline you need. This is regardless if there's a bug or not.

Ouch

What's the current opinion on the minimum discipline needed to survive PvP for a melee character?

[AstralUniverse]

I would aim for 70+ now with the coming stream of giants.

[Good Character]

Epic dodge will eat the first attack in the enemy's attack round sequence. If the enemy is spamming KD on you, the first attack in their round sequence isnt their only max ab attack because they are likely also hasted. So you can (and should) entirely ignore the presence of epic dodge when you decide how much discipline you need. This is regardless if there's a bug or not.

Ouch

What's the current opinion on the minimum discipline needed to survive PvP for a melee character?

Always assume those who want to capitalize on Knockdown or Disarm are large-sized or using large+ weapons who maximize strength. Ideally, these builds are hitting 54+ AB easily.

You 1 over their skill check to avoid being knocked down/disarmed. Always prep for the nat 20 they land.

This means you want at least 75 discipline.

[xf1313]

go shadowdancer if that number is too impossible to reach for a rogue, hips and run.

The alternative is be a druid... Druid rogue with elemental shape that is knockdown immune

[Edens_Fall]

I would aim for 70+ now with the coming stream of giants.

Dear Gods . . . How is that even doable?

[AstralUniverse]

I would aim for 70+ now with the coming stream of giants.

Dear Gods . . . How is that even doable?

Lets count!

33 ranks + 10 ESF + 22 gear + 2 bull pot = 67. Add skill focus and you're at 70+. If you're a div build you can probably get 3-5 more points from str on top of this.

It's still pretty bad against a stone giant hexblade hexing you and spamming IKD but you're a dexer with epic dodge for the matter so you need a weakness. This is fine.

[Ork]

Something to consider: epic dodge doesn't really block the first attack - it blocks the first successful attack in an attack round. The issue with KD is that you can force a character to "burn" their epic dodge by using any combat maneuver (disarm, kd, etc) even if that attack misses.

Edodge is still enormously powerful and you're going to avoid KD attempts pretty readily in the majority of cases. Still invest in discipline since those big AB builds can trigger your Edodge on the first round with a KD - miss or hit - and then KD you again on the subsequent attack.