Berzerker's Loincloth Feedback

[Kalthariam]

Hey there,

So I like this item, it has alot of nice things a barbarian would find useful.

+2 Con
+1 Str
+1 Dex.
10% Physical DR
1 Regen Per round.

However there seems to be a fair number of.. well drawbacks with this armor that feel a little excessive.

-1 Armor AC
-1 Dodge AC
25% Vunerability to Cold
It's Clothing so it has no base AC.

Now, maybe I'm out of the loop? But As far as I know, even if this armor was a +5 Armor instead of a -2 Armor effectively, Barbarians likely would never be AC juggernauts, though making this effectively -2 Clothing feels like a bit of overkill to me.

I know Barbarians are known for having high HP pools and high DR, but I am uncertain the drawbacks of this barbarian only armor works well. Just kinda feels like it makes the squishy even squishier

To be honest, I don't know how old this item is, I don't know if it's a more recent edition or just a very old item, but I'm wondering if prehaps some of the downsides could be trimmed off? If you have to massively boost the UMD on it to prevent people UMD'ing to get access to this (Not sure who would want to personally, but hey, I'm not familar with everything in the game) Then I think that's fine? I don't think I can think of anyone whom is pushing 40 UMD to use this as a non-barbarian.

[Wethrinea]

It fits a particular type of barbarian: EDR3, two-handing Barb/WM.

Barbarians can reach respectable AC numbers if you go sword and board due to the dodge bonus, and my guess is that without the AC penalties it would simply be too strong for dex Seeker clerics and anyone else who could benefit from both magic vestment and high dex.

For a barbarian not in the aforementioned category, it has limited value. Elven chain offers almost the same amount of DI for a lot more AC. The stat bonuses are attractive, but it is not difficult to make up for it by dweomering. 1 regen is nice, but doesent make a huge difference.

As a flavour item though, it is perfect.

[Kalthariam]

Elven Chain is annoying to get ahold of in the Underdark due to the Race Limitations, not to mention I just don't see Elven Chain armor fitting the "Fantasy" of a barbarian quite as well as the bezerkers loincloth, I'm still using it over elven chain mail, even on my Dual Axe Gnoll whom isn't going 3 edr.

Just sort of don't see why the armor needs to be a -2 AC Peice of Cloth I guess.

Though I don't undersatnd why Dex Seeker Clerics would want this? Can they even wear it?

If it's a UMD issue just make it a 80+ UMD item.

[MRFTW]

I don't play a barb so I might be missing something really obvious, but don't EDR barbs use armour of immolation?

[Kalthariam]

An Armor of Immolation? I've never heard of a barbarian using that.

I could be way out of the loop though.

I always consider that a Sorcerer Armor or something of the like due to it having +2 Charisma on it.

[RedGiant]

I don't think the armor would be "too-good" for clerics. As one who has a dex-based cleric in the stable, I still wouldn't use it, even if you took away the negatives. Invested clerics can +5 any armor they want. I can also fit exactly the skills and stats I want on any old piece of cloth. In fact, I think mine just improved the vesture he spawned with until it was epic-level.

In short, the stats are nice and the DR is great. But, lets face it. My cleric can +5 his vesture. He can regen himself, where +1 more is really inconsequential. The stats are not the ones I need on a dex cleric. (Mine uses trans + vitality to easily max the physicals, so WIS and CHA are preferred.) And, perhaps most important of all, you can't possibly fit the skills and saves you will likewise need on it (Disc, Uni, etc. ).

Related, I think a number of craftables and loot items with minuses need to be looked at. There is no good reason for the Duergan Coronet to make you suck at all those skills. Linthorax Vests just take up space . Etc,

[MRFTW]

An Armor of Immolation? I've never heard of a barbarian using that.

I could be way out of the loop though.

I always consider that a Sorcerer Armor or something of the like due to it having +2 Charisma on it.

Now I look at the wiki at the item, I think you're right and and it was more of an RP choice from the player I met using it. Not sure how effective that unlimited elemental shield would really be.

[Kalthariam]

I imagine the damage shield is useful if your always being hit. Though the lack of really any good stats on it for a barbarian makes me wonder why they would choose that? Unless they just use it and swap?

I think acid sheathe is stronger anyways if you really wanted a damage shield.

[Wethrinea]

The damage shield also gives 50% immunity to fire and cold. Very useful in certain epic dungeons when you tank with HP and DR.

[Naghast]

I find it funny that you're less vulnerable to cold

Completely naked

Than when wearing a loincloth

[Nazmina]

As someone who has only played barb pretty much since I started on arelith a year ago I'd say the berserked cloth is nearly useless in every situation.

I get the idea that it supposed to be useful to get some DI and regen in situations where as a non AC/shield barb you would have no ac anyway, but that doesn't really pan out.

In pve even the highest mobs only have about 50ab (exlcuding certain bosses) which means even as a wm barb or edr bar with 43 ac you still have a chance to dodge some of the 3rd and 4th iterative attacks which you are more likely to face in stand still combat in pve, and dodging even a few attacks will reduce the damage you take far more than 5% di, assuming you even get that much, against slashing enemies you'll take the same damage far more often. Especially with how crit conformation works. the 1 regen is so low as to be negligible. And this isnt just an assumpton, ive run several dungeons with elven chain and then a second run with berserker cloth and cloth always meant I need to stop to heal more often. And if you do face cold damage it just gets even worse.

And in PVP using cloth to dumpster your ac means even with imp expertise up anyone will be able to be autohit on every attack, where as with the 43 ac you can get with elven chain you'll actually have a chance to dodge some attacks if they use it. And given that many people use slash weapons you might not even see a difference in damage. The cold penalty certain becomes an issue against spellblades and casters.

The only real advantage of the cloth is the amount of stats it has, but the dex is of minimal use given the terrible ac, and with the new dweomer coming the extra con/str and specific saves arent as big a deal give how much you lose.

I do think the cloth needs to go back to the drawing board, if the no ac route is going to maintained maybe remove the cold penalty and increase the slash DI 5% and up the regen, change the dex out for another str.

Alternatively make it into leather or padded armor and remove the ac penalty but have it not give extra ac or make it low, like 2-3, then keep the other stats as is.

I will say I wish there were more barb armor options, basically all us barbs are using elven chain except for the new players who think the cloth is good.

[Kalthariam]

I use the Loincloth because I like the RP fantasy of a Barbarian that isn't wearing armor, but trades defense for offensive capabilities.

My issue is I think the Loincloth doesn't provide enough offensive benefit, for all the negative defensive benefits it gets.

I'm not really certain how you make the armor more offensive, but I will say as an Underdark Barbarian elven chain mail is frustrating as hell to get ahold of.