Arelith

Hey all, while I understand there is a reasonable IG motivation for the Merchant League kicking monstrous races out of Sibayad, I'm concerned that this change effectively locks the entire region away from monster PCs.

The only way into the desert is through Sibayad, unless you have the Outskirts or Coast portals (which would in most cases require going through Sibayad). There is no portal out except back through Sibayad and I'm pretty sure that the smuggler won't serve monster races so that's not an option either.

Is this the intent behind the change, or an unintended effect of it?

To be fair, the Merchant's league has ALWAYS banned or been in stark opposition to monster races, willing only to put up with what would bring the most coin to their pockets.

There is also a UD entrance by the coast.

Nitro wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:53 am There is also a UD entrance by the coast.

That's boarded up by a locked door that requires special access to use, if I recall.
Though I do believe that the OP is incorrect in that you have to go through the town at all to access anywhere else on Siyabad, there are ways around the town to get to the Lost Desert, Orclands, Tombs, etc.

I mean... speaking from a DM perspective... if you want to pop up a quick Invis, or stealth through, or disguise though (where you can) or heck just charge through at full pelt to the other side - I don't think I'd have a problem with that? I think the team can be understanding there.

It's just that the days of wandering around as a gnoll fully visable and shopping are gone I'm afraid.

There isn't really a way to walk around the town from that side, but if you are going that route on a monster you are already walking through crows nest and talking to an npc.

There are two ways to access sibayad from UD (not counting yoink) that don't require going through the town of sibayad or crows nest.

Are we talking a mid level monsters 2 ways of getting there or needing a bunch of epic to take them because of certain death below level 21?

chris a gogo wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:50 pm Are we talking a mid level monsters 2 ways of getting there or needing a bunch of epic to take them because of certain death below level 21?

One is in a low level dungeon and can be done solo before level 10 on some builds.
The second requires a key so I guess it isn't really fair to call that second one easily accessible, but it does technically exist.

You'd need help (or be a pirate monster pc, which is a reward) but I believe the smuggler is a third way, as well.

The GrumpyCat wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:29 pm I mean... speaking from a DM perspective... if you want to pop up a quick Invis, or stealth through, or disguise though (where you can) or heck just charge through at full pelt to the other side - I don't think I'd have a problem with that? I think the team can be understanding there.

It's just that the days of wandering around as a gnoll fully visable and shopping are gone I'm afraid.

I think this is reasonable and makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the clarification!

The GrumpyCat wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:29 pm I mean... speaking from a DM perspective... if you want to pop up a quick Invis, or stealth through, or disguise though (where you can) or heck just charge through at full pelt to the other side - I don't think I'd have a problem with that? I think the team can be understanding there.

It's just that the days of wandering around as a gnoll fully visable and shopping are gone I'm afraid.

I'm thinking we need an Evil town/fort on the surface.

Technically any settlement can be evil. But what's suggested here is monster friendly.
And that's just not the direction the server is planning to head.

Cordor has always been LN/LE, they had a very authoritarian chancellor, followed by Banites running the show and continued down the LN road to today.

Sib is kinda the opposite but CN/CE.

The idea of an isolated monster settlement with an Underdark tunnel that isn't just an extension of Andunor would be cool imo.

Scylon wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:07 pm

The GrumpyCat wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:29 pm I mean... speaking from a DM perspective... if you want to pop up a quick Invis, or stealth through, or disguise though (where you can) or heck just charge through at full pelt to the other side - I don't think I'd have a problem with that? I think the team can be understanding there.

It's just that the days of wandering around as a gnoll fully visable and shopping are gone I'm afraid.

I'm thinking we need an Evil town/fort on the surface.

The problem with Sibayad being that, though, and the problem that every overtly in-your-face evil faction has had that has tried to set themselves up in Sibayad, is that Sibayad sits right ontop of the best grind spots on the surface. You can go from 13 to 30 without ever leaving Sibayad, if you wanted to. So anyone who settles themselves down there to be antagonistic is going to have a bad time as people come in to go "No. Leave the only good grindspot alone."

DangerDolphin wrote: Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:20 am The idea of an isolated monster settlement with an Underdark tunnel that isn't just an extension of Andunor would be cool imo.

Having a surface "camp" for that that isn't in syb would be good. some where else remote.

DangerDolphin wrote: Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:20 am Cordor has always been LN/LE, they had a very authoritarian chancellor, followed by Banites running the show and continued down the LN road to today.

While I agree Cordor is often LN, and the most prominent temple being to Red Knight seems to enforce this as being intentional, to say that the city at large has "always" been evil leaning is just, ignorant. Banites did not "run the show" after Katernin's regime, that is OOC groupthink/rumor mongering. There was one Banite in the government at the time (who was constantly being overruled by various paladins, good aligned clerics, self-interested neutrals, and so on), and the prevailing laws specifically allowed for individual freedoms and dignity (which is not.. very banelike at all.)

In the past, Cordor has had many paladin chancellors. In the recent past, even, it was notorious for having them. Spreading wrong ingame information as fact is harmful, please don't do that.

All right, just for the record, this thread is not about Cordor's alignment.

Officially it is LN from various happenings in game, but the individual governments can vary wildly based on participation and player counts and leanings. It would be unfair to say that any settlement is "this".

I'd like to focus on any additional comments or questions regarding the monster restrictions regarding Sibayad.
And I have already asked previously about additional settlements and allowed areas for Underdark races (not talking about Duergar and deep gnomes) and the server direction will not be adding such a space for the foreseeable future.

DangerDolphin wrote: Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:20 am The idea of an isolated monster settlement with an Underdark tunnel that isn't just an extension of Andunor would be cool imo.

Pittown Part 2: Kobold Boogaloo

I agree that it is unfortunate that there isn't a non-Andunor settlement for UDers to chill about, and that there's no stronghold on the surface for monster races. But I also agree that sibayad really shouldn't be that settlement, as it is too antagonistic to the idea of a true neutral (or even NE) surface trading hub. I would personally love for there to be a starting city, perhaps in a cave system somewhere on the island, for monster races... but The Powers That Be have already said that monster races are on thin ice and that they won't be getting any sweets or additions to their ranks any time soon. Big Sad.

The problem is back during Pit town days things started to get spread out. You had drow trying to rebuild Udos, goblins took over Grond, gnolls had a spot in some caves, Kobolds took over the tower, duergar tried to make Jhared's trade post theirs etc.... So everyone was pushed back together. What usually happens is diiferent races start to want their own areas or sections.

Maybe make the ogre caves area a seperate district. Restrict surface races from "openly" holding power, make it so they have to gain power behind the scenes.

I think the original question this thread was asking was answered.