Arelith

Hello!

I wanted to talk about the recent change to the Spell “Harm”. While I don’t object to its nerfing, I do want to point out that the only reason one took the DEATH domain was to get that super burst of damage on a target. This is of course assuming the target didn’t just ward themselves with a simple potion or happen to be any kind of DEX based class who one can never touch. Now there is really no reason to even take DEATH over the standard options of Travel or Trickery.

So instead, can I ask we give a little back to DEATH after taking away it only real draw? A boost to undead summons over the ESF: Necromancy maybe? Replacing the Summon Shadow spell with something that’s useful like an extra free Summon Undead? Even better, allowing the Cleric who takes the DEATH domain access to the spell Circle of Death?

Anything to give players the inventive to take the domain while allowing those who already have a reason to keep it.

Thank you!!

I'm probably going to remake my cleric that has death domain. It doesn't seem worth it anymore when I could instead take travel and be able to cast haste instead.

While the difference from 405 to 324 is significant, note that doing 405 single-target damage on a touch attack is too powerful. You are still doing 54 more damage than a cleric without death domain, which is still powerful. (numbers are from a 27 cleric/3 dip)

If the shadow gained through death domain is revised then it will be a cool domain to pick.

Also note that the other negative energy based spells are still empowered at 50%.

Ork wrote: Mon May 17, 2021 6:07 pm While the difference from 405 to 324 is significant, note that doing 405 single-target damage on a touch attack is too powerful. You are still doing 54 more damage than a cleric without death domain, which is still powerful. (numbers are from a 27 cleric/3 dip)

I'm not saying the nerf was wrong, just that now the main reason to take the domain is gone. Lets also be honest, at least from my own experience. Harm while awesome, was very easy to counter with potion or spell. Even more so if your a monk as no touch attack can land upon.

But I don't want Harm returned to what it was, only a little love shown to a domain no one has reason to take (and some of us are stuck with unless we want to roll) when Improved Invisibility or Mass Haste is far more useful.

With Skillmageddon, I'm glad the dev team forsaw the coming timestop strength cleric meta and took steps against it. Hopefully it will be enough.

I wouldnt be surprised if an entire cleric domain overhaul was on the "To Do" list. There really are very few domains worth picking. I pity the poor dev who takes that on!

People really do love using the word meta these days. Honestly all the domains could use some love, but we get what we get. One day maybe!

Empowered Harm still amplified by 50%?

Ork wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 12:02 am People really do love using the word meta these days. Honestly all the domains could use some love, but we get what we get. One day maybe!

Very true!

Edens_Fall wrote: Mon May 17, 2021 6:58 pm

Ork wrote: Mon May 17, 2021 6:07 pm While the difference from 405 to 324 is significant, note that doing 405 single-target damage on a touch attack is too powerful. You are still doing 54 more damage than a cleric without death domain, which is still powerful. (numbers are from a 27 cleric/3 dip)

I'm not saying the nerf was wrong, just that now the main reason to take the domain is gone. Lets also be honest, at least from my own experience. Harm while awesome, was very easy to counter with potion or spell. Even more so if your a monk as no touch attack can land upon.

But I don't want Harm returned to what it was, only a little love shown to a domain no one has reason to take (and some of us are stuck with unless we want to roll) when Improved Invisibility or Mass Haste is far more useful.

afaik no domain has access to mass haste, just regular haste.

Oops!

AND this is why I don't make my own character builds

I'm not sure that combo w/ old death domain is any scarier than the average 1 round treatment from a str crit build in your base critting well over 200.. In fact it's probably actually harder to pull given you can ward against the harm & it requires a well executed combo, not just... smash smash dead.

Jordenk wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 6:51 pm I'm not sure that combo w/ old death domain is any scarier than the average 1 round treatment from a str crit build in your base critting well over 200.. In fact it's probably actually harder to pull given you can ward against the harm & it requires a well executed combo, not just... smash smash dead.

Death domain was/is very scary when you have a cleric with 80 lore and access to timestop.

Okay, now timestop clerics aren't a potential issue.
NEP is a easy ward to have, although it doesn't last that long from its potion form. High dex already was fairly save but realistically that domain is now pretty much in the area of "why would you pick it"
324 damage versus 270 damage is not a big question if travel, trickery or war offer much more.
That damage also sin't that impressive if a lot of str crit builds archive this number much more reliably, more often and not limited by spellslots and much harder to counter.
War domain now shines a lot more, sadly you cannot swap domains so previous death domain clerics are a bit locked in their niche of easy to counter one trick click that others can do a lot easier.

TL;DR you can archive the same result much easier with a lot less counterplay.
Did need a nerf but seems bad in the overall picture to me.