Arelith

If this was already made I couldn't find it with the search function. Sorry

I love the update, as now traps are somewhat usable without being overpowered. On average, a failed save against a deadly trap does around 115 damage or so. The DC of 30 isn't terribly high, but its not unreasonable either if you're shooting at a targets weak save. Failed DC damage is around 65-75.

I love that its actually possible to find and disarm player traps now, as beforehand it was impossible after you hit a mid-level trap setter.

The only thing that stands out is that some of the DC's are lower for some traps than others. Deadly electric , frost, and acid splash traps is 25. I can understand acid and frost, as they have secondary effects of blindness and paralysis, but electric doesn't have any secondary effects. Making a successful saving throw makes the damage negligable, especially with elemental DR buffs. And a DC of 25 is pretty low, even if its your weak save.

Electric traps are effectively the worst trap type because of this. I don't know if they're supposed to be more damaging, but I haven't seen a noticable difference in damage between electric traps and other, supposedly less-damaging trap types (sonic, fire, etc)

Gas is still completely useless, as it still has a DC of 20 for deadly traps.

Trap by trap....
Acid Blob : Haven't been able to find enough to test. You can't craft them either.

Acid Splash: 25 DC saves are kind of disappointing, but I can understand it because blindness is an excellent status effect.

Electrical: Worthless due to the very low DC, no secondary effect, and the prevelance of evasion/imp. evasion

Fire : A high damaging trap with no secondary effect. However, it has a 30 DC for deadly traps, unlike electric traps, so they're a simple, solid damage dealing trap.

Frost : Not bad. Again, a 25 DC means i've never seen the paralysis effect fire off, but paralysis -is- quite strong.
Holy : Good for undead still

Negative : I'd actually say these aren't worth it. It has 2 saves attached to it; one for damage and one for the stat drain. The stat drain, if successful, only lasts 3 rounds. While I'm glad it isn't a permanent effect like the old traps, its too inconsistent to be worthwhile. Especially considering you can't purchase the components to craft these. I'd be willing to see reduced stat damage in exchange for rolling it all into a single save.

Sonic : My go to trap right now for damage dealing, ironically. Sonic damage has a save vs stun, but the damage they do is still consistent, espeically considering sonic is the least commonly resisted damage type.

Spike: Useful for weakening faster or DEX based enemies. IF they can make the save. The catch-22 is they seem to be designed to be more useful against dex enemies...by targeting their reflex save.

Tangle; Still useful for crowd control!


The only thing that I'd tweak across the board is a way to increase the save DC's by 5 across the board, as 30 isn't bad, but its definitely not something I'd consider for higher or end game enemies. Too much prep time for very questionable payoffs. Its possible to fire off at pc builds with a weak save (base weak saves will be about 9), but npcs have higher saves and they tend to be all over the place.

at what lvl of rogue where you testing?

0! The character I tested had zero rogue levels. Do rogue levels affect how traps work?

Rogues get +1 DC per 5 levels, and epic traps are also higher DCs than deadly. Traps do not need higher DCs.

Ah. I didn't realize that was a thing. That works then!

The gas traps still need to be reworked, they are the only ones that are base NWN.

garrbear758 wrote: Sat Apr 16, 2022 2:39 pm Rogues get +1 DC per 5 levels, and epic traps are also higher DCs than deadly. Traps do not need higher DCs.

I seem to remember looking at the combat logs in the PGCC and seeing no evidence that the actual save versus the trap had a higher DC.

Maybe my memory is foggy or this is shadowy math that isn't accurately portrayed in the logs.

I have used traps with a full rogue char quite abundantly.

I can't speak of PVP because I'm not experienced in that domain.

For PVE I've found almost every traps useful and efficient, with that exception:
Gas traps.
Their DC is indeed very low (and targets fortitude, which is often a high save in PVE). What's worse is that their effect is to lower constitution, not a bad effect in itself, but that means that you try to lower the fortitude saves of an ennemy by attacking that very save. Not very useful, because if an ennemy has low constitution then you probably don't need to weaken him xD. The exception is the minor version of the gas trap, that could lower dexterity, but with a DC so low that it's a dead end. A bit sad that you can't use this kind of "slowly build your victory" tool.

As someone who used traps a lot, I tend to believe the timer to set a trap (and disarm/retrieve) is a bit high. I'd probably half it if I could. (perhaps at the cost of a feat?)

Otherwise, kudos for all the good things that have been added to the traps features since I started to play Arelith. They really made the trap experience better!

Something might be off with Trap DC.
I put a Deadly Tangle Trap down and it triggered with DC29. It should have been 30 + 4(Rogue levels). I asked if the player I tried it on had seen the trap (-5 to DC), they said no. They have 17 in search.