Arelith

I'd first like to say that I do truly appreciate the effort the DM team has put into increasing the number and frequency of events. This is a tremendous amount of work and creativity that you're donating to the community. However, there's a particular plot that I'd like to provide some feedback on.

It is an instinctive response in most people--even those not particularly saintly--to neither harm children nor idly stand by as children are harmed. To my understanding, this is a large part of why non-adult PCs aren't allowed; players would feel obligated to protect the child PC or would find themselves unable to instigate PvP against a child no matter what said child did. They are a universal soft-spot.

This same protective instinct can cause some huge issues for any plots involving imperiled child NPCs. While it's certainly a perfect instigator to get people of otherwise-disparate interests moving to accomplish a common goal (even most evils would bend their self-centered ways for the sake of an endangered child), the problem comes when the children are perpetually imperiled for weeks or months, in-character. Most characters are of a mindset where a child in danger is a problem requiring immediate dogged response (which is the case in real life), but when it comes to a multi-part DM event, operating on the "drop everything and keep looking/fighting/etc. until the children are safe because time is of the essence" instinct isn't really an option because we have to wait for the next session of that plot, and the players have to come up with excuses for why their characters are not currently doing the One Thing that is in nearly everyone's hardest-coded instincts to do...but will do that One Thing in a week and a half.

It would be much easier for players/characters to manage if any plots involving children in danger were completely resolved in a single session.

???

Feedback is welcome.

When it comes to DM events, I’d suggest sending a PM to the Active DMs with the feedback as a general post might lead to stray conversations outside the facts of the events.

The DMs do their best to try and run the events as frequent as possible, but real life will always take priority. I will, however, agree that characters in immediate peril in a DM event likely should be done in a single event if possible - that way that gap does not exist in the characters action and no one questions why you are just standing around. Though that is just my opinion.

It's not just children really, although I can understand why it triggered the writing of this thread. Any large scale event that had the literal fate of Toril on the line, or something around that, could (and sometimes did) result in "omg what do we do now" as soon as the event's session ended. That's not to say that events shouldnt have more than one session but how a session ends and what the characters involved are left to do should be taken into account as much as possible, as much as real life allows.

I'm with Astral here. I think this is just a common theme with big DM events and the time between outcomes from our work lives, etc.

Like when Andunor has it's biannual illithid invasion, which is categorically a manifest nightmare for all inhabitants, but in between terror inducing attacks there's just the average days of shenanigans and regular backstabbery as if nothing happened. It's all anyone can do, and nobody is to blame.

I'm not the biggest fan of events for the 'drop everything and go' reason, but I think the key is to just try and abstract the time between events and treat the DM arc sort of like a mini-series kicked off from the main story so that it's no too disruptive to ongoing player-side stories.

Oh. I was expecting this to be a thread on scared little girls and why the heck they hit so hard without crit. DANGER!

We do all enjoy the vampire kiddos that can wipe the floor with our party!

AstralUniverse wrote: Sun May 08, 2022 12:10 am It's not just children really, although I can understand why it triggered the writing of this thread. Any large scale event that had the literal fate of Toril on the line, or something around that, could (and sometimes did) result in "omg what do we do now" as soon as the event's session ended. That's not to say that events shouldnt have more than one session but how a session ends and what the characters involved are left to do should be taken into account as much as possible, as much as real life allows.

So firstly I concur that it's good to end a session, if it's a multipart one, with a bit of a hint on what the players might want to do next in the interim.

I'm a mum and I'm not running events much now because my childs sleep patterns arn't great, and the times that he does so arn't predictable. So I can sit down to do an event, but stand a good chance of having to leave it due to kid waking up, and that's not fun on players.

But even if my childs seep was absolutly 100% good, and reliable I'd only have about four hours in the night AT MOST to run anything (this presuming I skiped dinner).

Given at least an hour of that can be taken up with preparation/getting people together, that's not time to run a World Ending Uber event in one session.

Often with events I run, I like them to have effects on the world. I'm sorr but I LIKE people to talk about them, or rp around them, or do things around them inbetween. I think that's really cool. think it's (Gasp!) a GOOD thing to have stuff for players to take up, on their own intitiatve between events.

For example lets say there's a plauge event. And I as a DM do the first part settign up the plauge and then getting someone (e.g. Thorimand, making this up as I go along) to say that they need to get the magical cure from the isle of Nod, and he can open up a portal for them tomorrow. Then end the session and tell people I'll be back tomorrow to fix it, mean time they can rp the plauge as they wish.

To me that's in fact much BETTER than concluding the event in one session. Becauser - especially if I t ake time to make the plauge 'visable' in Cordor, that gives something people to talk about, to rp around.

A plauge event concluded in one session is great for the five pcs involved.

A plauge event that's done in the course of a week gives people lots to roleplay around. Cure efforts. Fake cure salesmen. Paranoia. Talks about previous plauges. Attempts at helping people. ect. Just a few examples if players want to go wild and make stories for other players and have fun.

But even if the above wasn't true, the simple fact is that bigger events, when they're run, take multiple sessions inevitably. And further more we can't always dictate when how how the sessions end. We'll be called away. or players will move too slowly. Or people will do unexpected things. If we want to make it a prerequisite of Dming that you must have at leastg 8+solid hours free to play a day, then it pretty much rules out anyone with a life.

At the risk of sounding as angry with this as I actually am, what this comes across to me as is:
'wahh! my empowerment fantasy is ruined! I can't FIX THE THING in one session all by myself! My character feels helpless! I MUST NEVER FEEL HELPLESS!;'
'Er, what about other players getting in on the stor-'
'HELLS WITH OTHER PLAYERS ME! ME! ME! ME! ME!'

Sorry but I do want to get other people involved in hte event. I want to make Arelith feel like an evolving, interesting world, and I can't do that if every single little problem is fixed within five minutes of it showing up by a tiny amount of people who leap onto it like rabid dogs.

I mean this is like saying 'it's awful we have so many dungeons full of monsters and no matter how many times my pc kills them they return. Please make it so that next time my pc kills them, they're gone forever,.'
'but what about the xp of oth-'
'MAH EMPOWERMENT!'

Like, y'know, sometimes we leave bad stuff floating around so that other people have something to talk about. If they want.


That means that yes, yes, sometimes things will happen that your character can't 'fix' immedatly. Oh well. Deal with it.

Module updates to create continuity I think are a way to bridge that gap. Idk this plot in particular but if you had a plot and on the next server reset the module was updated to reflect the actions of that plot it can add to the scenic drama and intrigue.

Like idk if a child is abducted the plot comes to an end maybe a squad of guards is in the Cordor square and you speak to them and they just say like "We're gathering supplies for the expedition and can leave soon." Just like a book mark for the next time the plot resumes.

Or Illithids in Andunor maybe there's more peace keepers and some battle debris.

It's minor stuff in my opinion but I think it helps create a fuller complete picture and allows more players the opportunity to witness and find ways to be in the plot

I think it's kind of funny with Andunor you see all these victory posts about a great battle with an enemy but you'll never IC be able to find that battlefield because the module never changes to reflect day by day stuff.

To shoot holes in my.own suggestion I understand Arelith is massive and doing these would take time. A lot of things can break and DM turn over would make it hard to have anyone experienced retain the know how. And depending on how the module is updated it could be a nightmare keeping versions straight.

The Plot you refer to, is of my creation.

If you are familiar with how the event has been conducted so far, you are aware that at no point is their evidence to suggest harm has been done. In fact, every interaction seems to indicate the opposite, the abductions have consisted of enchantments and charms. As well as several PCs raising the point, that harm would be counter-active to what they believe the intention is behind the actions thus far.

With respect to the time frame, their has been a disruption and a halt on the progression to a conclusion. My three year old Son has been furiously unwell. I've been to the hospital twice with him, in a single week. Only in these recent days has he started to recover from a bacterial infection that has left him feverish and vometting like clockwork. I did approach several players that were actively involved in the story and I notified them, that I have had to step away for a period of time as my child is unwell. As even when he is in bed, I was unable to sit at my computer for any promised period of time as he was very unsettled.

So whilst I appreciate that you, for whatever reason, feel slighted and that this is not an ideal situation for your Character, it is something you are going to have to overcome. Because it is the result of my real life world taking quite a pummeling.

Royal Blood wrote: Sun May 08, 2022 10:05 am Module updates to create continuity I think are a way to bridge that gap. Idk this plot in particular but if you had a plot and on the next server reset the module was updated to reflect the actions of that plot it can add to the scenic drama and intrigue.

Like idk if a child is abducted the plot comes to an end maybe a squad of guards is in the Cordor square and you speak to them and they just say like "We're gathering supplies for the expedition and can leave soon." Just like a book mark for the next time the plot resumes.

Or Illithids in Andunor maybe there's more peace keepers and some battle debris.

It's minor stuff in my opinion but I think it helps create a fuller complete picture and allows more players the opportunity to witness and find ways to be in the plot

I think it's kind of funny with Andunor you see all these victory posts about a great battle with an enemy but you'll never IC be able to find that battlefield because the module never changes to reflect day by day stuff.

To shoot holes in my.own suggestion I understand Arelith is massive and doing these would take time. A lot of things can break and DM turn over would make it hard to have anyone experienced retain the know how. And depending on how the module is updated it could be a nightmare keeping versions straight.

In principle I 100% agree with this. This would be awsome and amazing!

To a small extent it is, in fact, something we do. As in we can place say, rubble around an area that's attacked and make it 'stay' there for until the next server reset.

But perminent server changes for each event are sadly (and it is sadly because it would be awsome) not really logistically possible for a vareity of reasons.

I may list them when I've more time to type later.