Half-Elf

[Shiki]

If a build is completely and totally optimal the team often -undermine- that build [Monk, anyone?] in order to effectively penalise people taking optimal builds!

Optimal is not mathematically the best numbers inventable by a brain fantasizing about might-have-beens on the server, but the best numbers achievable under the constraints of the devs design for what should be achievable, and optimal builds should be roughly equal with some leeway for give and take regarding what they're good at. A wizard, built well, is not going to compete at being a melee basher with a battlecleric. A spellsword, built well, is not going to be competing with a caster cleric at being a caster.

If you are good at something, you should also be bad at something, or somethings. An archer is not going to win at battleaxes with a barbarian. The barbarian probably shouldn't out-shoot the ranger. The two actually do fairly similar damage, however. The archer has options for staying out of combat, generally, and the barbarian is a meatball who doesn't stay out of combat at all.

On paper, the two are fairly balanced vs each other. I stress that this is on paper, as in play things are affected by a LOT of variables, CJ and Zav stay away from me. I am not afraid of you.

If a build is totally dominant, it does, indeed, get nerfed, because it's performing well above where they want it to, and where they want things is what's optimal, as -XXX- just said.

edit: I am afraid of CJ and Zav

[Zavandar]

how can you confuse optimality with being overpowered

I know your grasp of the english language is better than that

something can be optimal but not op

smh

[magistrasa]

Do we plan on talking about half elves again or are we just going to keep splitting hairs and going down the balance discussion rabbit hole

[malcolm_mountainslayer]

Do we plan on talking about half elves again or are we just going to keep splitting hairs and going down the balance discussion rabbit hole

Philosophical rabbit holes, all the way down!

[CptJonas]

Do we plan on talking about half elves again or are we just going to keep splitting hairs and going down the balance discussion rabbit hole

Philosophical rabbit holes, all the way down!

I know I shouldnt be doing this since I was one to create this topic...but lets everyone reply to Magistrasa...se we can see that guy like xy times in row...

[Seven Sons of Sin]

I'd like to see half-elves tied to elvish subraces more. But in general, the fact Half-Elves in 3.5 don't have any of their human heritage boons has always struck me as poor design (they have bonuses vs. Sleep, but can multiclass like humans can? idk).

I also don't think half-elves should get access to the moonblade.

But I also think Arcane Archer shouldn't be race-restricted, but what can ye do.

[cowboy]

I'd like to see half-elves tied to elvish subraces more. But in general, the fact Half-Elves in 3.5 don't have any of their human heritage boons has always struck me as poor design (they have bonuses vs. Sleep, but can multiclass like humans can? idk).

I also don't think half-elves should get access to the moonblade.

But I also think Arcane Archer shouldn't be race-restricted, but what can ye do.

That is why I think it should just be that combo; a little juice from the elf parent and then a small pool of feats to choose from based on elvishness to sort of represent their humanity.

Maybe increase keen senses, elf weapon prof, to dodge, and a couple of others. It lets them feel different without being bland. It's much better than giving them the LOL THEY GET +2 CHARISMA and are GOOD DIPLOMATS they got in some editions. Which doesn't make any sense because they're just a slightly less heavy background than a half-orc; confused and abused trope.

[Babylon System is the Vampire]

Just building on some of the ideas already put down, I like the idea of this:

Half Elves, +15 skill points at level one (yeah this is just telling people to skill dump, but everyone does it already anyways).

Half sun elf +1 int, -1 con

Half wood elf +1 strength, -1 con.

ect ect ect Im sure you don't need me to list all of the elven sub races.

Remove all of the current bonuses.