Vampire Max Blood

[Skibbles]

(I don't think this stuff is FOIG but I don't even know the exact numbers anyway)

After the regen bug was brought up in the Bug Forum again it got me thinking about the upcoming time change and how it might relate to having 100% blood.

All the Vampire boosts are only in effect at maximum blood: meaning it lasts only until the next server tick: meaning you can only remain at the max between .001 seconds to 6 minutes (we'll call this the Spooky Window for brevity).

So if, in preparation of a boss fight or expecting confrontation, the vampire consumes blood to get to 100% - the bonuses can be lost in mere seconds simply due to bad timing or just a few lines of RP being had.

My proposal is simple: adjust the Spooky Window by just one extra server tick. After the time change this means that the Spooky Window will be from 5.01 minutes to 10 minutes which is only a 4 minute increase at maximum but is on average to be lower unless you're actually counting server ticks and timing consumption with it.

This doesn't seem all that substantial of an increase, but it would make it less frustrating to reach the cap and lose it twenty seconds later which happens fairly often during RP or exploration.

[Curve]

This is my experience too. If you do anything other than killing things your blood rate drops so swiftly that you have to constantly chug blood vials. It’s mildly immersion breaking that you have to drink SO MUCH BLOOD. Sometimes even when actively in a dungeon and killing monsters your blood level can slip away.

The op’s suggestion is great, but I would say it does not go far enough.

[Edens_Fall]

I also agree! The blood loss is rather high per tick near 100% to the point I don't even bother trying to get the max effects anymore. An increase of time, decrease of blood loss, or increase the length max bonus is in effect (say from 90% to 100%), etc.

[Skibbles]

There's probably a mathematical term for the way blood swiftly goes down to around baseline 60% when it slows greatly, and I suspect this is for a lot of balance reasons since you retain about half, or a little less, bonuses at Baseline Spooky.

The first drop is 5%, so I think my proposal would mean just adjusting the Spooky Window to 94.9% instead of 95% currently.

[Jagel]

Liareth posted a while back on the subject. You are not supposed to be sitting at 100% by design.

[Skibbles]

Ya, and I definitely don't want it increased into the stratosphere. The rapid return to baseline I think is great for the most part, and it's where almost all the time is spent.

I just hope it can be extended by 1-4 minutes so I don't feel so rushed, or awkwardly using the same item twice in a row just because of the coincidental timing of the server's clock.

[Curve]

I found the posts (thanks Jagel) and I see that this is working as intended. I suppose my question is, what is the point of the stat increases on a purely mechanical level if they can not be counted on? I know that Liareth was/is mechanically savvy (i do not know if they are still around) but I am confused with the intention with gearing a vampire. If the bonuses kick in when your STR/DEX/CON are maxed through enchants/buffs (not a hard mark to hit) then they seem to be a waste/somewhat useless. Or, if you gear considering the vampire soft stat buffs you are left in a particularly unique position stat wise where you need to drink a vial of blood or kill things to operate at your maximum. This is all purely mechanical. I would question it RP wise, but I am sure arguments can be made for both sides.

[Edens_Fall]

If I recall it was a balance issue from back in the day when effects lasted longer. Though honestly considering the weaknesses and limit to where they can travel due to daylight, I am of the opinion that vampires should be on the OP side of things. Dangerous creatures to be feared. Now it just feels like one need only change thier spell book before facing one or bring a cleric.

[Rico_scorpion]

One could argue that any design that creates tediousness/clunkyness on the playerside, even if balanced or by design/bugfree, is probably questionnable in its DNA.

All players want their main stat (and even secondaries) to be maxed out at all times when adventuring. So either vampires ignore the soft-stat buff (= a waste of a boon), and gear without it in mind to make sure they are always topped, or their gearing take it into account in which case they MUST be blood-maxed out at all times because if they don't it creates the frustration of being suboptimal for no reason. This guides the player toward a tedious behavior harmful to their sense of fun, and it's generally a good habit in game design to protect players from their predictable habit to "do something unfun repeatedly if that means being better/stronger".

In this logic, a minor buff would be to have the "max power" lasts 2 ticks, and a real QoL move would be to have it last even longer than 2 ticks or/and reduce the CD of "feed" (note: all while acknowledging(and respecting) the fact that it wasn't the first design intention of vampire).

My two cents!

[RedGiant]

1) Besides the mechanical issues, which some say are intentional, there is also the rp angle of the Hellsing Ultimate quantities of blood ingestion required.

Srsly. You have to ingest a sentient every six minutes. Or at least down their alchemically preserved remnants by going through craftables faster than an Epic Evoker goes through spell components.

2) There is also a mechanical cliff of a counter. If you've never played a vamp, imagine the fiercest counter in the game that means more to you than any counter in the game. Now imagine the counter drops by a full 6% or sometimes inexplicably more.

No one is saying we need more power, but something more reasonable in the consumption mechanic would be greatly appreciated.

Maybe I'm off here, but even a vamp that fed once a night in a storybook would be considered voracious. Arelithpires are at /least/12x that voracious...with most been many, many times moreso.

In short, feeding should meaningful and required, but you shouldn't have to drink London every night.

Maybe a way to go here would be a drink from a PC or Thrall gives you x3 length between feedings?

[Skibbles]

I didn't think this would get so much attention!

I don't think anyone needs to be reminded of the upsides of the subrace, especially in PVE content, but it takes about 24 minutes to return to being a no-gift character which is very painful in the current and long lasting meta.

Maybe a way to go here would be a drink from a PC or Thrall gives you x3 length between feedings?

I really like this idea since it encourages roleplay. Right now, with the nature of the diminishing returns, biting a PC gives them a huge 24 hour CON penalty that also sometimes hard-crashes the server in certain scenarios.

The vampire however benefits from it almost not at all, and if they do it's for about half an hour at most unless they were critically starving. This unbalanced relationship (24 hour penalty for a 24 minute boost) makes it difficult to find a reason to engage in the mechanic.

It feels like something is wrong with the sliding scale, because between about 50-60% (this is generally baseline) and 95% not much seems to happen.

Also since it's been mentioned a few times I wouldn't mind a link to the thread with Liareth!

[Hazard]

Vampires in D&D don't need to feed.
They want to.
A vampire can exist in perpetuity without feeding, but it would be a withered, pathetic, torturous state. Just the /worst/.

Vampires on Arelith, need to feed constantly or they start withering, and will even DIE.
Something I suggested be removed, and the suggestion was approved, but I don't think it's come through yet.

[Edens_Fall]

Your mention of the victim's effect is also spot on. I generally avoid too many PC feedings as the 24 hour penalty they suffer doesn't warrant the blood taken. I always feel guilty about that and thus generally only feed for the RP experience and rely on vials all other times.