Sacred Flame

[WanderingPoet]

Subject: Sacred Flame boost

Rejected as there would be no reason to cast Inflict Minor Wounds if this got changed. It's a trade-off: If you prefer safety (over damage), cast Sacred Flame, otherwise use the Inflict spell.

I think that forcing people to choose between safety and damage here isn't really fair to Cloister Clerics and Healer clerics who are all about being backline support. They are designed to not be up front casting spells. So it's not even a choice for them, they only get one option.

Additionally, inflict minor wounds doesn't make -thematic- sense for a lot of clerics. In Character and in Roleplay it would make very little sense for say a priest of a goodly deity to be walking up to someone and burst negative energy into someone's face. This I think would be the main reason it's not overly used.

Also, wizards, sorcs, spellswords, shamans, druids, and warlocks all get decent ranged damage cantrips. It's pretty inconsistent to indicate that it's for the balance of safety over damage when every other caster except for Cleric and Favoured Soul get full power ranged options.

If the reason is that no one would use Inflict Minor Wounds if Clerics/FS got equal treatment for ranged spell cantrips, then the problem sounds with Inflict Minor Wounds.

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As a note unrelated to the above suggestion. Could Sacred flame please have a reduced blinding VFX? Having the entire screen turn bright white for a second is painful on the eyes and risks those of us sensitive to flickering lights causing migraines/seizures.

[Mattamue]

Get a domain with a low level spell and high replenish chance like Forge and Hammer of the Gods. Cold and Ice Dagger is bonkers. Its okay that Clerics are different from Wizards and don't have a ranged spam cantrip. Clerics have other things. Choosing between things is good game design.

100% agree the effect is too bright.

[Kalopsia]

The VFX should already be a lot less obnoxious, there's been an issue with the corresponding model file.

Sacred Flame damage scales based on distance to the target, so these goodly clerics can cast it at close range and inflict similar damage to Inflict Minor Wounds.

[WanderingPoet]

Get a domain with a low level spell and high replenish chance like Forge and Hammer of the Gods. Cold and Ice Dagger is bonkers. Its okay that Clerics are different from Wizards and don't have a ranged spam cantrip. Clerics have other things. Choosing between things is good game design.

100% agree the effect is too bright.

While I agree "Choosing between things is good game design", there has to be a choice. Not every domain has a low level spell with high replenishment chance, and healers don't get any replenishment chance. Clerics are expected to pick domains related to their deity, so basically this is saying that if you choose a deity that doesn't have one of a 8 domains with low level damage spells then you're out of luck on doing anything useful in combat. This also ignores my point that -every- class except Clerics/FS get ranged spam cantrips, including fellow divine caster druids/shamans. Which is sort of my issue, that there isn't any real choice in what you get to do.

The VFX should already be a lot less obnoxious, there's been an issue with the corresponding model file.

Sacred Flame damage scales based on distance to the target, so these goodly clerics can cast it at close range and inflict similar damage to Inflict Minor Wounds.

Maybe a bug then, I still get bright screen flicker most of the time when I cast it. It's the main reason I don't use it, because it gives me a headache.

d3 damage means that at level 30 it has an average of 20 damage on a level 30 cleric. There are not many spells that do less average damage than this.

It is a good point that goodly clerics can move closer; so that they use positive energy and get the damage. That said, it's not very clear how close one has to be to deal the 1d6 damage. What is close range here, 10m? 5m? I was under the impression it was only 1d6 when you were in melee.

It also doesn't help clerics that are designed to be on the backline, like cloister/healer. Fortunately spellbound wands help there, as they can get a spammable spell that way.

[Party in the forest at midnight]

I was disappointed reading that as well. Touch attacks are really unfun, I don't use inflict minor wounds. Even if my summon has aggro, casting next to something will cause attacks of opportunity and aggro will switch to me. Not to mention how frustrating it is to miss with touch attack spells.

Regarding domains, my big issue with cloistered cleric right now is it feels like you're really shoehorned into what domains you take. Thematic domains aren't useful domains. And a while ago Ropes was planning on having 3 domains that worshippers of each god would be banned from taking, so I'm wary to change domains too much in case this is still planned. It would be nice if more domains had useful damage spells available at lower levels. Emphasis on useful, magic missile is really sad as a spell.

I don't like the spell refund method, it's extremely unreliable. It makes me feel like I shouldn't cast magic because I will run out really quickly. In contrast wizard incentivizes casting a lot since you get a chance at a free offensive spell cast. Caster cleric feels much more summon reliant than wizard, my wizards have a lot more they're able to do in fights.

[Exordius]

Yeah inflict minor wounds is nice but almost worthless in pvp and against high ac enemies, same with harm. Maybe if they made both not require a touch attack they would become more useful, especially for low strength builds.

[Party in the forest at midnight]

It's not just that, but they're very easy to counter too. Not only does negative energy protection stop it entirely, but concealment causes a 50% miss chance too. I can understand harm having a lot of counters, it does a very large amount of damage. And I understand that defiler cleric is really strong and can get ridiculous numbers with inflict spells, so having several counters against them is good. But it's a strong penalty on a cantrip that's meant to be a main damage source for non-defiler casters.

[Exordius]

Only other thing you can do is take the air domain since its power is a good damage spell and its reusable in a matter of seconds. On the other hand though the other spells in air are pretty bad so your just trading one suck for another.

[AstralUniverse]

It's worth mentioning here that Defensive Casting mode makes it so you do not provoke attacks of opportunity against you when casting in melee range from enemies. There's also no failure on 1s in this and no reason not to have it on at all times once your concentration score exceeds 15+spell level.

[I am War]

If we look at the designs of the path, sacred flame is really meant to be inferior so players are encouraged to utilize what each path provides in terms of refunds:
(Pathless not withstanding)
Warpriest: well, they should be hitting something so this path isn’t relevant to this particular discussion

Seeker: refunds illusion, but given the low Div Power duration, they want to be tactical on when they use this. Chances are getting Div power up and and spamming color spray for the refund isn’t the best use of action economy for seekers.

Cloistered: some really good domains with damage potential and high refund chance are the elemental ones, forge, and death domain. The CC ones work, too, like mind or illusion domains

Evangelist: my favorite is to spam Command or Mind domain’s low level CC spells. This path works best with allies and party buffs, so it should focus on CC instead of damage dealing (I’d argue any caster path clerics should do this)

Healer: think it’s very self explanatory

Favored Soul might be getting the short end of the straw here, but that is what they pay for spontaneous casting imo. For thematics sake they should also be offered more “domain” spells as spellbook selection so the handful of those cloistered FvS can get some refunds